Toyota Aurion TRD Breaks Cover
23 Jun, 2007
52 Comments 
It seems that with all the Falcon Orion hype, Toyota is taking any chance it can to push its new TRD Aurion. Hidden in the back of a recent press release is Toyota’s new TRD Aurion.
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CarAdvice has been advised that the TRD Aurion and TRD Hilux will be available in two trims respectively.
TRD Aurion:
TRD Aurion 3500S
TRD Aurion 3500SL
TRD Hilux:
TRD Hilux 4000S
TRD Hilux 4000SL
It appears that the ‘S’ models (most probably standing for ’supercharged’) will be at the bottom of the TRD range in each model, whilst the ‘SL’ models (presumably ’supercharged luxury’) will feature extra features to appeal to the punters with a bit of extra cash.
The TRD 3500SL will probably feature some of the additional gizmos and gadgets that the current Presara features - such as Xenon HID headlights and satellite navigation.
Initially suspected to go up against the likes of Holden’s performance arm HSV and Ford’s performance arm FPV, Toyota said that it would go up against cars like the Alfa 159, VW R32 Golf, Subaru Liberty GT Spec B and Mazda6 MPS instead, culling any thoughts of an all-wheel-drive road tearer.
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June 23rd, 2007 at 9:02 pm
Doesnt look quite as sporty as the concept and other photos going around… think its obvious they are appealing to the luxury car market given that… or maybe its the SL that has the extra chrome here and their.. in which case the S may look alittle more ‘athletic’.
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June 24th, 2007 at 8:23 am
My thoughts exactly Paul. A little disappointing if this is the sports model, but with all that chrome - I suspect not!
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June 24th, 2007 at 9:17 am
Yeah not only that I think the rims as well… they are very conservative, you see base models with those kinda bland rims!!! Look at something like the HSV GTS… now they are what I wanna see… and some of the spy shots did show better rims so fingers crossed (and this does have a big effect, Ive seen a handful of sportivos with aftermarket rims and it transforms the while look of the car imo).
Still looks alrite though… and we know its also about whats under that bonnet!
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June 24th, 2007 at 1:56 pm
I don’t mind it, it looks nice in black. Not as sporty looking as the concept, but a lot better than the normal Aurions. 3500SL sounds very Mercedes (SL350).
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June 24th, 2007 at 2:07 pm
I was having a conversation with a cousin. Discussing the whole idea about him getting a car, a point (which I hate to admit) came up.. going along the lines that with Toyota offering the Aurion Atx for taxi drivers, the whole image thing is really gone down the drain. I mean fair enough with the Camry, because Toyota said that they will offer something more luxurious, Lexus styled options, the whole glitsy details etc and then you turn around to see that even though you might be in a Sportivo or Presara , the average moe joe is in the same car just a simpler version of it. Thats screwed up, thats why wheels magazine showed the Aurion and Camry sales to be somewhat similar.
I’m not a fan of Holden, but hey they stopped selling to taxis, I mean ok Holden = unreliable anyway in the first place for taxi drivers, I wouldn’t get a ford because they’re all taxis then you have Atx Aurions and the thing is taxi drivers like the idea of fuel efficiency and reliability, but hold on you drive a Presara, Prodigy or Sportivo..
The market here being based alot on perception, makes it an issue for the Aurion to sell in good numbers, so even though this Trd is being launched, I hate to say it but I doubt much will change for the Aurion.
feel free to correct my view, because I’d like to hear what others have to say on it.
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June 24th, 2007 at 3:03 pm
I dont think the car being used for Taxis means anything to be honest… I know I certainly never think less of Falcons for it and I dont know who does! So I dont think it applies to the regular Aurion line up. And then you step up to the TRD Aurion, well with that logic its like saying FPV have an image problem because they have Falcons as taxis… again not true and TRD is the same thing, its what FPV is to Ford. And not to mention their are premier cap services which have Fairlanes and the like… hardly an image problem with that…. and going off what your saying as well, the image not being as great because an everage joe drives it… does this mean in Italy the Lambos have image probs cos the cops have them lol?
And I havent seen an Aurion taxis YET!
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June 24th, 2007 at 3:20 pm
Well personally Paul, I don’t see it like that however it appears to be the case with a majority of buyers. I mean I know some Asian friends parents, who would rather a simple bland low spec 3 series over say a well equipped Aurion just because its that image thing. I have seen a couple of Aurion taxis around. Not to class out average moe joe, but its saying that a car that you own which is meant to be a luxury/performance offering from the manufacturer is at the same time the car that everyone uses as their taxi.
I know personally that in Singapore when they bought out alot of C and E series Mercs as Taxis that it affected the sales in the private buying sector by alot.
Also the Prodigy Aurion that was taken for a test drive (cousin + friends), turns out it had rattle and squeek issues from parcel shelf to the centre console, now even though its a test vehicle but thats an indication to its build quality put to the test. Now I assume that the car was from an initial batch of released Aurions but then when we look at sale figures the Aurion sales aren’t quite up there as such.
I do hope that the TRD is a big success, trust me I really do, if anyone has ever read any of my past posts, I’m all for Toyota and Lexus but then not everyone sees it the way I do :P lol.
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June 24th, 2007 at 3:31 pm
Well I just dont think its an issue… they would be using base Aurions so the ATX, which is a car you hardly buy for image. Then as you go up the range its differentiated from the ‘taxi aurions’ n e way as they have more features and external diferences. So even with that logic still not sure!! And on top of all this the TRD Aurion is seperate from Toyota and shares even less similarities with the ATX… not only the obvious things like body kit, interior styling and rims, but underneath the skin bigger brakes, better suspension, a supercharger etc!
Toyotas aernt immune to quality issues though… but I dont think thats effecting sales, people at least perceive Toyotas are reliable and have good quality, once theyve bought the car and then realise it has a rattle thats when its to late and sale has already been done! But yeah the dealer is at fault their, he must wander why he hasnt sold many Aurions!
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June 24th, 2007 at 3:49 pm
I don’t see it as an issue. You judge the car by how it drives, performs, looks etc. and not labeled as a rental or taxi. For example I have seen the Korean Barina used a lot as a rental car, I don’t judge it becauses it’s a rental, I judge it because it is a mediocre car.
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June 24th, 2007 at 6:12 pm
xr6 turbo will smoke this car with its shit front wheel drive the worst way to make a performance car now come on all the torque steer and lack of turn in. traction control will be always stepping in get pretty enoying
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June 24th, 2007 at 6:25 pm
What does ‘BOB’ mean? ‘Big overweight Bogan’, by any chance? Myke, Paul, do you guys want to have a guess. So a bogan such as yourself, who has never driven an Aurion, wants to comment on a yet to be released car, which he cannot afford, and will not be able to test drive, as dealrs do not allow bogans to test drive their cars, as they risk being stolen. The XR6 turbo will smoke this car? Show me the evidence? You mean more wheel spin and tire smoke? Maybe. Until you know how active stability and traction control work, why make assumptions based on nothing. And then with the traction control piece. Always kicking in? Isn’t that what it is supposed to do? It would be no different in the VE Bomadore, when you continually oversteer, with the big barge and poor aerodynamics. Heck, the VE doesn’t even allow you to turn off the traction control. But I suppose your the expert. Especially with such a cool secretive name. Okay, Paul and Myke, better have a better comment for you than mine.
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June 24th, 2007 at 6:57 pm
I think the Commodore does have switchable on/off TCS. We don’t know whether this car will suffer a lot of Torque Steer, yet. I think the Falcon XR6T will be faster still though, it may weigh more but it has roughly 15kw and 80Nm more power and torque respectively.
The general stereotype is that the TRD wont be able to handle the power/torque through the front wheels. I have a feeling that may be the case. As this is the first time Toyota has had a stab at a ’sports’ car in a long time.
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June 24th, 2007 at 6:57 pm
In response to Damo above.
You can readily switch off ESP in any vehicle in the VE range (including the Omega and sports models).
The Aurion already verges on mild torque steer, adding more power in the form of a supercharger will simply exacerbate the fact.
And yes, the XR6 Turbo would smoke anything that Toyota will attempt to release, the TRD has been marketed against cars like the Alfa and VW Golf R32, so it won’t stand a chance against the XR6T.
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June 24th, 2007 at 7:13 pm
It has been indicated that the Aurion will have 240kw and 400Nm of torque… so thats only 5kw less then the XR6 and 80Nm. Now torque is pulling power, you have a heavier car (XR6T), you need more pulling power. You have a lighter car (TRD Aurion, you need less pulling power. To have the same effect that is in accleration, you can never have to much of course!
Now the standard Aurion has 40kw and 60Nm less and goes from 0-100km/h in 7.4seconds. On top of this, the supposed lack of low down torque is fixed with a supercharger, providing a flatter torque curve. So you can easily expect if these figures are correct that the Aurion will do the 100 in very low 6s. The XR6T does it in 6.5. Hardly smoking the Aurion… even worse case scenario I dont see this at all. Given that the TRD Aurion isnt just about flooring it in a straightline but an overall driving ‘experience’ with its features and handling upgrades… this is more than adequate!
As for torque steer, I will guarrantee Toyota aka TRD would not even bother releasing this vehicle if it had massive torque steer… so this is a baseless comment. I would think that even if their were issues, theyd be inclined to limit power down low (ie Traction control) rather then release it and have people understeer into poles. And as Damo said, every car has traction and it kicks in earlier on RWD’s as they dont have a heavy engine over their drive wheels…. the only reason why FWD is bad is because in the hands of retards who cant drive them, they are inclined to sink the pedal around corners and lose steering (in comes traction control for them). And tbh Im not sure if TC will have an option or not on TRD… I rememeber seeing a video where the guy mentioned spinning the wheels on the TRD, and this was a TRD employee… so maybe it is optional (or maybe he means before TC kicks in you get it slightly who knows!).
Eitherway, I wouldnt be writing this one off just yet!
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June 24th, 2007 at 8:06 pm
i think paul should take some of his fellow toyota fans advice (Damo) and not make assumptions on things as far out as torque curves. hell Bob like him or not made a simple claim that the XR6T would still beat it, yet he got cruicified. and the funny thing is you all agreed that that would prob be the case
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June 24th, 2007 at 8:09 pm
“The Aurion already verges on mild torque steer”
Actually, it doesn’t, not at all. It’s likely the fact that the stability system kicks in to prevent it when flooring the accelerator, but I didn’t feel a thing in the AT-X I took over a weekend, nor the ZR6 that I ended up buying.
jdm102, I’ve never seen an Aurion taxi myself, but I have seen Camry and Avalon taxis. I’ve also seen Commodore and Falcon taxis. I’m an Asian, and I don’t have the budget for anything more an A-Class or a BMW 1 series, and wanted something better spec’d than a Camry, so I picked up an Aurion. I know others who were looking at the Lexus IS250, who ended up getting a Presara for the better features (Asian and non Asian). It’s all a matter of choice.
Frankly, I can’t agree when you say that the taxi image is an issue ‘with a majority of buyers’, because obviously, they’re not buying the Aurion in the first place :)
The Aurion is not aimed at the BMW drivers, it’s aimed at the Commodore/Falcon/380 drivers. Very squarely. Toyota doesn’t want 3 and 5 Series drivers in Aurions, they want them in IS250s and GS450hs!
Likewise, the TRD Aurion is aimed at the XR6T and SS drivers. Will it do much against them? Probably not the SS market - they’re typically too much beholden (no pun intended) to their brand and their RWD. Probably not the XR6T market either, as the Aurion just doesn’t have the same handling that the XR6T does (at least, not that I’ve noticed anyway).
However, I’d say that the 3500SL would probably give the Force 6 buyers a thought - the FPV is horrible value by comparison to the base XR6!
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June 24th, 2007 at 8:59 pm
QUOTE = i think paul should take some of his fellow toyota fans advice (Damo) and not make assumptions on things as far out as torque curves
In nice terms… I have proven his assumptions WRONG. Prove my torque curve assumption wrong? No it would be very unwise as its an inherant characteritic of supercharging.
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June 24th, 2007 at 11:10 pm
well said Paul - Toyota has enormous racing experience and knowhow with its Formula One activities and they sure as hell ain’t loosing $12.7 billion a year, as Ford did in 2006.
The TRD Aurion will be a serious competitor in its segment and will provide the usual outstanding value for money proposition as always.
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June 25th, 2007 at 12:15 am
Paul - don’t assume that torque steer is a forbidden trait.
Take a drive of the Holden Astra SRi turbo or if you’re game, the HSV VXR. They try and pull you off the road each time you sink the right foot, I’m thinking the TRD Aurion will be in the same boat.
With the Aurion’s current boat-like handling prowess, the handling would want to be something bloody special to trade blows with the big boys - a la XR6T, SS.
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June 25th, 2007 at 7:10 am
^
a. Your more than likely one of the people who said the exact same thing about the regular Aurion which really doesnt show any signs of torque steer… so your opinion is noted but hardly relied upon
b. Im sure the ATX handles like a boat like all the others. Overall the Aurions handle well, one particular review of the sportier VE, Falcon and Aurion actually said it was BETTER then the Falcon and just behind the VE. So yes handles like a boat! And on top of all this, the TRD Aurion has had a number of suspension changes on top of this.
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June 25th, 2007 at 10:04 am
^
Paul, considering I’ve driven both the SRi turbo and HSV VXR, I’d know that they torque steer to the buggery.
The Aurion does have mild torque steer and a supercharger will simply exacerbate the fact.
Care to quote your source for that review? As every other review I’ve read has placed the Aurion last when it comes to handling - or lack thereof.
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June 25th, 2007 at 12:55 pm
I like it. The TRD Aurion in black looks excellant and unlike some other comments - the wheels look great. Personally, i cannot wait For the TRD Aurion because i believe it will a very nice car. Unlike the Holden and Ford counterparts, the TRD will be refined, well sorted and of high quality. Apart from that, it will exhibit all the traditional Toyota qualities… reliability, dependability and durability !!
I’ve driven 2 Sportivo variants to date and was thoroughly impressed by them. Apart from the impressive power output, the handling was respectful while i found the brakes to be very snappy.
What some negative individuals are not acknowledging here is that TRD and Prodrive are two very respected performance companies and thay have been engineering the TRD Aurion for quite sometime and it is my understanding that considerable amount of R&D, refinement, testing and evaluations have been invested into this project and i have absolute confidance that the TRD Aurion will be a very formiable force within it’s own rights.
How Toyota is going about establishing it’s performance cars is very clever. TRD will no-doubt occupy the lower end of the scale while Lexus with thier upcoming IS-F and LF-A series will satisfy the more expensive presitage market.
The Aurion will offer something differant instead of the ’same ole same ole’ that Holden and Ford keep offering and it is sure to establish it’s own niche market while giving greater recognition for the Toyota brand.
I LIKE IT - LOOKS GREAT !!
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June 25th, 2007 at 1:16 pm
HSV has a very oridinary reputation for engineering quality cars. The previous GEN3 was a dog of a donk that drank oil, slapped pistons and seized engines. HSV cars are also widely renouned for premature brake fade, overheating fluids and shredding tyres when pushed hard.
Observe ‘Motor’s January edition of the performance car shootout. 20 cars were tested and HSV feel out at a very dismal 18th position with brake fade after just one lap… that’s right - after just 1 lap. What good is that ??
Apart from that, they are unrefined, unreliable and of poorer quality compared to other eqivalant performance cars and do not age with any grace or dinity what so ever. Within only a couple of years from new a typical HSV will rattle, squeek, give thier owners grieve and be worth nothing.
My guess is that the TRD Aurion will be greater then that but only time will tell. Ever since TRD got involved with the Australian Rally Championships (ARC) the Corolla has been a very formidable force winning more races then all the other teams combined. The latest Australian TRD Rally Corolla produces 190kw from a normally aspirated 2.0ltr engine.
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June 25th, 2007 at 1:53 pm
IS EVERYONE FORGETTING SOMETHING…..THE FALCON IS OUT HOPEFULLY IN THE NEXT 12MONTHS… AND EVERYTHING I HAVE BEEN HEARING IS THAT THE XR6 TURBO WILL HAVE 260-270kw F6 ENGINE IN IT!!! SO IF THIS TRD STICKS WITH XR6 TURBO NOW IT WILL NOT THIS TIME NEXT YEAR LOL! SO THATS WHY THEY SAY IT NOT GOING AGAINEST THE XR6
and some one said it to go up againest the SS… i dont think so as the SS is 270KW V8… 0-100 6sec and mid 13’s over the 400m… so that not happening!!! and thats hard to say for me as i am a Ford fan, but its the truth
quoting Squishy now…
However, I’d say that the 3500SL would probably give the Force 6 buyers a thought….
I say to this…. What ever!!!!
People Who go by the Force 6 want a luxury car with performace… so the luxury TRD is not in the some class as the force 6!!!
why do i say this…. the TRD is going to be a supercharged 6 putting out 240kw 0-100 in mid 6’s but the force 6 is a turbo charged inline 6 with 270Kw engine (soon to be around 300kw in new falcon) and with its 270kw 0-100 in 5.3… sorry to differance classes…TRD want to be profamce luxury car for australia…. Force 6 luxury preformace car!!
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June 25th, 2007 at 2:08 pm
lets quote dingo now: The Aurion will offer something differant instead of the ’same ole same ole’ that Holden and Ford keep offering….
hey dingo… so you are saying that the typhoon,and XR6 turbo are some old some old??
What ever… the only reason why Toyota are ”hotting up there 6” is becuase of the success of the Xr6 turbo and typhoon, so really toyota is following ford, by hotting up a Six
some old some old by ford… so whats the XR5 turbo, the XR4, and the turbo falcons… ford has moved away from the V8s a little because the success of the high powered inline 6’s with a turbo?? what ever!!! as i also say it not toyota vs ford vs holden here…lets be honest, its TRD vs HSV vs FPV as these are not standard vehicles they are the special vehicles top cars… so it should be TRD aurion Vs GTS Vs Typhoon which are the top veh of the brands!!!
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June 25th, 2007 at 2:45 pm
The TRD Aurion will offer more luxury then what HSV and FPV offer Chopstar, the fact that they have an ‘SL” which we are being lead to believe is a luxury version has confimed this…although the next FPVs will be improved, I still dont think it will match the TRD Aurion. For example the current FPV doesnt have LED rear brake lights and the new one might not… minor, but your forking out $50K+!. The current one doesnt have projector headlamps or xenons… the next one more than likely will, but just going off what the TRD Aurion will compete against for 7months or so before the new Falcon. The top of the range Aurion has many features comparable and even some more then cars like the Honda Legend, a renowned luxury car, at $70k! The Aurion is also cheaper then the FPVs, you could say $5-10K cheaper then the FPVs with comparable features.
In terms of power, there is no denying something like an SS has it, but for example the SSV which is I believe $50k only alittle less then the TRD Aurion will be would literally have half the features… and it looks but ugly compared to the TRD Aurion off the pics we have.
And the Falcon will no doubt have power increases, but there is alot of speculation going about alot of which is unfounded. At worst out of all this you should be HAPPY that the TRD Aurion is coming out and undercutting the others in terms of value for money… because this only means they are going to have to follow suit and have more competitive prices!
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June 25th, 2007 at 3:49 pm
Christopher - point taken… i’ll stand partially corrected. However, the examples you meantioned are half-hearted attempts compared to the FPV (Falcon) units. Infact, thier performnace is relatively mundane while the HSV Astra really is a poor example outside of the HSV Commodore range.
Regardless, i strongly believe the TRD Aurion will be a great alternative and surely to establsih it’s own niche market.
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June 25th, 2007 at 4:21 pm
Paul, they are all good points, the main thing is that TRD and everyone is saying its going to be a performace luxury car, in my eyes a car worth around the value of the TRD and doesnt do under 6 isnt a performace car… its a luxury car… the cost of the Force is high compared to TRD, but the perfomace is pretty high as well compared to TRD!!!
i am all for competition, i am liking there will be more cars in the class of XR6 turbo and typhoon in australia
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June 25th, 2007 at 6:01 pm
Well we will have to wait and see the figures! I pointed out earlier, the Aurion does the 100 in 7.4seconds… you think given an extra 40kw, 60Nm of torque, very little extra weight and a great spread of torque that they will at least cut that down by 1second maybe alittle more. To me in the 6s is good enough… but its its up to the individuals. From a ford persons perspective the TRD is a good thing, I dont think it will steal to many sales from HSV or FPV, more just gettin people who would say get a ZR6 put out abit more for a TRD… whilst FPV will still be worried and in their new range offer comparable features at lower costs.
Same applies to the Aurion, you can guarrantee that the Aurion which is undoubtly the benchmark currently OVERALL in a family car sector, will be used by Ford to benchmark the Falcon again (they would obviously consider the VE as well)… so youd think they are gong to up the power, offer more features (not only offer as options wich they dont have now such as side airbags but standard), improve the handling and other positive aspects at relatively low cost as the market dictates. Prior to a 3rd real competitor in this market there wasnt heaps going on…whilst small cars for example had 6 airbags there were only two in the family cars. This has now changed.
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June 25th, 2007 at 6:20 pm
I think we can agree with Paul and say this car will handle fine, and a lot better than a standard Aurion which isn’t bad itself. It will run a low 6 0-100km and a low 14 0-400m. The only drawbacks will be slight wheelspin off the front wheels before TCL kicks in (which is even worse in an SS or XR6T), and possible, yet still controllable, and only slight torque steer, caused at low speeds below 60km/h. which will most likely be detected by the ESP system and eliminated quickly. Don’t forget this car includes and LSD! You cocktards know what a limited slip diff is don’t you?
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June 25th, 2007 at 7:26 pm
just a few things here,
1. paul, has the trd aurion been released? i didnt think it had. if not then it isnt competing against anything yet just like you say the new falcon range isnt.
2.Tony, you might want to go check your figures, 12.7 billion loss for ford?? also while you are at it you might want to book yourself into a business class. yes they did make a loss though. you will find a loss aint that bad. they are investing in the future of ford. what was reflected in that was the money invested in the new falcon development. you can not judge business figures over a small amount of time. doesnt matter if it is groceries or cars. eg. groceries….. the wholesalers bill gets paid this week for the month and sales wont equal that. means nothing!! if you go by that theory , well for the first 3 weeks in that month they were absolutely killing it.
3. i too do question the handling reviews put forward (i didnt read it all the way though i already got the snippet in question) how can the falcon go from the best handling car to overnight being something that is rubbish. and i wont buy “well the other models have caught up” cause that would be rubbish too. i will accept that most reviews say the commodore now edges out the falcon due to a lot of engineering in their new mod. but to say the falcon is now all of the sudden too sharp, lumpy, nervous, heavy and then too light, well…. TURN IT UP
4. chopstar raises some very good points here too. for one pointing out that TRD competes with FPV and HSV and therefore it shouldnt be compared to even something like the XR6 turbo (you are dealing with its even bigger brother here so even more good luck to you), and also the reason that toyota are hotting up 6’s is cause they have seen where ford have taken it and the success they have had with it.
5. as for looks i reckon the whole front end looks like the HSV Grange. if you were to show me just that i would argue that it was HSV. so bad news for you who think the HSV is ugly/awkward/bulky or what ever you say.
6. Paul,
I know you love your features lists, but one would have to ask if toyota are giving it all in their base model what more do they have to offer for the price they will seek?
also the reason toyota have to offer more features in their vehicles and be pretty competitive on pricing is that noone would touch them or even look twice at them. it is a common stratogy for new products breaking into a market to try and offer more at a reduced price, cause if they offer the same at the same price people will keep going for what they are familiar with. no reason to change, so why should they. that is what toyota is trying to overcome here.
and the best point from you (Paul) is that it makes the opposition think about the features they offer and hopefully bump them up. and i think ford and holden are doing exactlly that. you can see it with the release of extra additions packages that they both are now offering. the thing is if ford and holden come up to offer the features toyota offers as standard it will be back to base 1 for them. and if toyota find the extra sales they were counting on to make decent $$ on the aurion arent coming then they will have to raise the price a bit, and you bet ya the others will follow that too
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June 25th, 2007 at 7:37 pm
settle down Damo!!
i think we all know what an LSD is.
1. where does it say there will be on on the TRD?
2. ford and holden have LSD too
3. I havent really heard of LSD on FWD cars before and i question its effictiveness. i would think an LSD on the front would kill any handling traits and provide a lot of oversteer.
for mine FWD cars are too sensitive in the front end as is, that is trying to get a rugged drive line onto sensitive steering/suspension components
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June 25th, 2007 at 8:21 pm
Andrew - you passed some very spot on points and i certainly agree with most of what you have put forward.
Yes, Toyota has put alot of extra’s into the Aurion because it is a new product but regardless the Aurion is a damn good product of which is slowly but surely establishing itself a strong reputation for very good reasons.
One thing about Toyota though is that out of all the automotive companies on earth, Toyota by a huge mile has the greatest finances and resources of all therefore is able to sustain a stringent war against Holden or Ford for a damn lot longer then either of them. The fact is, Ford and GM have been heamorraging for several years now and expected to continue while Toyota has enjoyed runaway profits within the billions ontop of thier already huge wealth. What i am getting at is that when Toyota ups the anti so does Ford/Holden and the leap frog game begins. But… Toyota is in a much stronger postion to keep the anti game going for a damn lot longer then anyone else.
Apart from that, Toyota engineering is never to be under-estimated because that is exactly when the others drop the ball and Toyota moves in for the kill. Just observe it’s strenghth in Australia let-alone globally.
Toyota has done (and will be doing) a far more convincing job attacking the Commodore and Falcon then what Holden has done attacking the Camry with the Epica. Toyota’s strenghth is diverse right across just about ALL segments while Holden and Ford’s are limited and even those are being challenged by the mighiest of all and Holden and Ford DO NOT need that given their current struggle.
The TRD Aurion will be a good car and sure to give greater recognition not only for the Aurion but for Toyota while the upcoming V8 IS-F and V10 LF-A will take that challenge (and recognition) to dizzie heights.
GM and Ford can fend of Nissan, Mitsubishi, Hyundai, Subaru etc etc but they can not fend of Toyota… not forever anyway. The TRD Aurion will be a good car and the one pictured above looks great in black and i love the wheels. I have little doubt it will ooze quality and refinment while delivering good performance with a very competitive packaging manifest.
Like i said earlier, i have little doubt that the TRD Aurion will establish it’s own niche market and satisfy what Toyota hopes for it to do.
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June 25th, 2007 at 8:57 pm
Andrew, I cannot believe that everybody whom uses this site has an idea of what LSD stands for and how it mechanically works. I also find it immensely odd that you have never heard of an LSD on a front wheel drive car. As the main local competitor to this vehcile, the upcoming TMR380, uses a “Helical” LSD. Even the TJ Ralliart Magna from 2002, 5 years ago, offered one, and yet you doubt the Aurion can have one. But at the same time, if you guys did want to prove your predictions of high quantities of torque steer, you could point out the fact that Toyota have not allowed any car magazines to test the model, or the fact that the VXR Vectra had massive torque steer, and yet it also had ESP and TCL, and was still released. It also had massive wheelspin. Lucky only Europe got that ugly dog!LOL
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June 25th, 2007 at 10:11 pm
wow never heard of an LSD, there is an LSD gear box for Honda CRX 94and up, u can chuck that into an 90model honda civic old square shape imported from america..if u didnt know.. Limited Slip Differential people.what is it used for..
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June 25th, 2007 at 10:51 pm
Im going to do a quicky as I havent got heaps of time:
1. You say it cant be compared to an XR6T, I say it can… there is the same price difference between a TRD and a FPV (FPV being higher) that there is between an XR6T and a TRD. So Im quite sure when being are looking for a boosted 6 cylinder they will consider all their options and make a value based decision… and the TRD Aurion will no doubt be very tempting
2. It does look about like the HSV Grange or whatever its called from that pic… but its mainly the pic. When you see a proper front on of it its prity disinctive and decent looking
3. LSD would be a good on the TRD… I am also suprised you havent heard of LSDs on FWD cars, hell in the U.S they even have supercharged V6 Camrys going around with them!!!
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June 25th, 2007 at 11:37 pm
Whoever used Toyota’s involvement in F1 as a glowing example of their performance qualities needs their head read. The biggest budget for the poorest return. They have employed ex Ferrari employees whom were subsequently found guilty of industrial espionage. Hell they can’t even beat Williams!
If it’s like the rest of their products it’ll be too conservative to be truly enjoyable unless you find brown cardigans exciting!
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June 26th, 2007 at 12:25 am
Roo - clearly you haven’t noticed the LF Lexus cars which have already broken cover.
Toyota have more money to spend than any other car company in the world - they are number one - where have you been mate!!
Toyota will eventually outgun the Germans at what they do best - they have all the time in the world to get it right - oh and the money. There are just as many speed freaks working at Toyota who want to build fast cars but selling cars is the number one priority for any car company - or do you have a different view?
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June 26th, 2007 at 7:15 am
Lol Roo Im not sure about who mentioned F1 and your continuing on it… what they do with that I dont think has much of an effect if any on production vehicles, so I really couldnt care less about Toyota in F1.
All I care about is the TRD Aurion has nearly arrived, its set to be a quality package… awaiting more info on it - nearly only a month or so till its release now!
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June 26th, 2007 at 8:16 am
Roo, you are right about Toyota in Formula 1 but like evrything else they do - Toyota will persist with it until they get it right. Regardless, Toyota entering Formula 1 has been a tremendous experiance for them because the engineering expertise to be gained from this pinnacle of all racing is enormous. Toyota infact has the second highest budget (behind Ferrari) and are actually sitting mid-field (6th position from 11 teams).
What you have failed to highlight however is that most of the fore-running teams are all long term teams that have been involved with Formula1 for generations upon generations while Ferrari has been involved since the very first day. Ranault dominated Formula one for a couple of years until recently and that was after nearly twenty years of experinace.
When Toyota launched Lexus most of the automotive industry sneezed at them but after years of persisting Lexus has evolved to become one of the greatest auotomotive companies of all. I believe Toyota’s involvement with Formula 1 will eventually evolve to be the same because one thing i like about Toyota is that they are extremely resiliant. Don’t forget Toyota’s involvement in the WRC - when they decided to withdraw infavour of F1, Toyota was the World’s dominate Rally Force and ruled the roost for years.
Admittedly Toyota done away with sports and perfromance cars for some unknown and silly reason but had a very rich and relatively successful history when they did. Remember the Celica GT4, Turbo MR2’s and Supra’s… ??? I now believe they have relized thier mistake and are making a charge to re-enter the scene and i reserve little doubt that they will be very successful in the years to follow. MARK MY WORDS !!
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June 28th, 2007 at 7:18 pm
Dingo,
please not that Prodrive is also involved with ford in motorsport aswell, and to add further like every one else pointed out that means nothing anyway and in road car terms it means even less for toyota because an F1 car is nowhere near a road going version that toyota offer.
Damo,
the diff set up you are talking about is what i would associate more with an allwheel drive car. a typical LSD provides the same power to both wheels and continues to do so until the vehicle is turning at a rate which becomes impracticle for both wheels to turn at the same rate as the turning circumference changes. an LSD hangs on to the drive in both wheels for longer. therefore i figure if both wheels turn at the same rate once you start to turn it would cause handling problems.
and howabout a reply to the other points in that post you were replying too as well and not just the ones you would like to pick at
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July 10th, 2007 at 2:20 pm
A lot of talk about wheelspin /torque steer etc The standard Aurion is remarkably free of torque effects - this is an objective fact. I would be surpised if the TRD had much torque steer, but yes I can’t imagine that it won’t have a lot of help off the line to tame the horses. This will be a problem for some - not me. But interestingly have a look at the Toyota site for the 0-100 km dash between Aurion,Holden,380 and Falcon - the Aurion blitzed them all by what appears to be quite a few cars lenths to the nearest competitor -the Falcon. If I am not mistaken the Holden appears to have trouble getting off the line smoothly - the Aurion very is smooth. I am more interested in the driving experience - rolling performance should be very quick indeed, and i suspect instant response at any time with that sweet blower on the job (more than adequate for me) but the steering, turn in and general handling will be very interesting to sample. The 3500sl is on my short list sight unseen -I hope I am not dissappointed.
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July 10th, 2007 at 4:37 pm
Yeah Im not suprised it won, the margin was prity impressive especially over the Commodore it was huge. Although when you think about it, it has all the advantages inheritant of a FWD… lighter, higher traction threshold as weight over drive wheels, more power as less lost through drivetrain…. along with a slicker 6 speed transmission (they more than likely used the 4 speed Falcon) while it has the disadvantages of FWD such as torque steer minimised to a neglible level if not eliminated. Its a credit to Toyota, I doubt Ford or Holden could produce such as respectable FWD vehicle with that much power.
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July 10th, 2007 at 5:07 pm
So would that mean that the TRD Aurion will be in rivalry against the XR6T? Or just the XR6?
And what would Holden have to rival it?
Holden haven’t yet discovered how to properly use Turbo Charging and Super Charging. Or maybe they will just stick with the SV6.
In my opinion Toyota are releasing the TRD Aurion just to rival against the XR6T.
But good luck to Toyota, they might be the best Car brand on the planet, but they are going to need more then a Supercharger to beat an XR6T. Especially if the rumors are true about the XR6T ‘Orion’.
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July 10th, 2007 at 5:30 pm
Well they say its up against the Liberty GT etc… personally I see it also against the XR6T as the lower speced TRD Aurion wont be alot higher then it in terms of price.
As for power, well I think the TRD Aurion would get the current XR6T slightly… rumours at the Aurion will have 240kw and 400Nm, now the XR6T has similar figures abit more torque, but at the same time RWDs lose more power through the drivetrain. Also the lower Aurion does 100 in 7.4seconds so Id think with the extra power, torque and it all being produced down lower its going to cut the 100 down a fair bit.
As for the new XR6T, they are rumours at this stage, personally Ive heard it will be 270kw but tbh I cant see that happening, there will be an increase but it would seem illogical to put it that high unless there is also a price increased associated with it! Or else they are blurring the gap between FPV and the XR6T… why would you bother with a Typhoon if it has say 290kw or alittle more for $15k or so more! Also consider that although power will be up, the current XR6T is about 100k heavier then the Aurion, a fair amount, but thats without ESC and more importantly side or curtain airbags (prity sure). Thats going to add weight and weight has a massive effect on acceleration.
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July 10th, 2007 at 7:01 pm
1. yes for certain it would have been the 4sp auto falcon used in the demo 0-100. especially if it were on the toyota site. (therefore not a fair test in my opinion).
2. i doubt ford or holden would want to design a FWD car for starters. i think toyota are just wanting to stick with FWD for the hell of it. i mean there are no great advantages in it. i still dont think that a FWD would ever handle as well as what you can get a RWD to. for starters you need a lot of strut braces etc just to get half decent handling out of. and the other thing that worries me is the tyre wear you get on FWD cars or the lack of it on the rear. tyre wear (in most cases) a direct representation of the grip you are getting. the rears on FWD cars barely wear.
and one major thing is towing capacity. well say no more there.
3. yes the falcon may weigh more but it puts out more torque to combat that aswell.
4. and yes power figures on the falcon may be only rumours at the moment but so is the TRD. i mean it doesnt exist yet either.
5.the falcon doesnt have just a bit more torque… it has a hell of a lot more torque and even bigger than that is the fact that it is all delivered by 2000RPM. most people call that short shifting (2000rpm).
6. and if the XR6T goes up to 270kw then you would expect the higher models(F6 etc) to go up in the same proportion. power increase doesnt mean price goes up either. it means the manufacturer has refined/tuned it a bit more. nothing extra is added to justify a price increase.
and for the record the 6 sp ford offers would have to be the best out there at the moment
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July 11th, 2007 at 2:33 pm
Toyota’s will stick to FWD cars because it helps to distinquish it’s everyday models from it’s marque brand Lexus. With exception to the ES series, all Lexus vehicles are RWD or AWD whereas a typical evryday Toyota is FWD.
Besides, i am sure the Aurion will grow in popularity as the market becomes more familiar with it (remembering the Commodores has been around since ‘78 while the Falcon even longer) and i’m sure the experianced gained from developing the TRD Aurion will improve Toyota’s FWD vehicles in the generations to follow especially considering vehicles are getting more powerful by the model.
Holdens HSV Astra has been bagged something awful because of it’s cronic torque steer whereas Toyota’s engineering has been able to achieve respectable results.
The TRD Aurion is sure to be a great car within it’s own rights and no-doubt will establish itself a niche market while giving greater recognition not only to the everyday family Aurions but the Toyota brand itself… not that it needs any more recognition considering it market domination. The TRD Aurion is sure to satisfy the lower end of the performance market while Lexus with it’s upcoming IS-F and LF-A will satisfy the higher end. Good business to me… !!
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July 16th, 2007 at 3:13 pm
think about this: Toyota/TRD had earlier wanted to build an AWD TRD Aurion but technical difficulties/cost issues have prohibited that from happening. They admitted that.
Toyota then changed their line and now saying they’re up for the “luxury performance”, and going against Liberty, Audi, Alfa.. etc. And no longer aiming to take on Holden’s SS or Ford’s XR/XR6T. What a gimmick..
Toyota aint stupid! There ARE performance advantages in RWD over FWD — Else why are all the luxury Toyota (Lexus) sedans RWD’s? the IS, GS? and just the every-man’s Toyota Camry/Corolla are FWD.
I dont drive a Holden/Ford, in fact, I currently drive a Toyota. My next car wont be a Ford/Holden/Toyota :-)
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July 16th, 2007 at 3:39 pm
Hmmm there are performance advantages in FWD ETTan, the main one being a higher traction threshold as you have the driven wheels over the greatest mass, the engine. The main drawback is torque steer. Around a track a car fitted with the same engine and different configs will run very similar times, as both have advantages in different settings (RWD better at slow corners, FWD better at fast corners) and the FWD engine will have more power at the wheels, as they lose less, so overall they are prity even as a number of tests have shown. Street wise the disadvantages are even more reduced as there are driver aids to reduce the negative aspects of FWD (and RWD for that matter). The reason why RWD is used in Lexus is because of demand, RWDs are arguable more fun to drive and as a result consumers demand it, not to mention the stigma attached to FWD cars (supposedly not performance based).
At the end of the day TRD will produce a decent car in the Aurion, I dont think its going to be ground breaking… but it will get reasonable sales. On a side note, Ive heard reports of people seeing the TRD Aurion on the streets unclothed, they say it looks very nice. Im interested to see some more shots, given that its less then a month now till its released Toyota/TRD aernt doing a great job at hyping it up… only visible sign I have seen is their new TRD advert showing how they compete in various motorsport competitions (I think this is related to the TRD Aurions release).
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July 20th, 2007 at 4:49 pm
I think Toyota are fair dinkum on the target for this car - Subaru etc - they realise the Falcodore performance market is a rusted on fraternity - looking at the TRD 3500sl it does not look like a muscle car in the traditional sense - for me this is very good….the people who buy Subara Liberty GT’s etc are probably much the same. Also the Falcodore muscle scene tends to be very much about horsepower, burnouts, in your face stuff - i’m past that.
The whole TRD package appeals - tight, medium sized hunkered down exterior with lots of room inside - it looks the biz to me….but again I would not buy one if they do not get the steering, handling right, not worried about power that should be OK - and no, I don’t mean how it goes on a racetrack - I have an MX5 for that.
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July 21st, 2007 at 4:02 am
The reason TRD didn’t opt for an AWD Aurion was simply and solely because of the developmental costs associated considering the TRD Aurion is only engineered for Australia’s relatively small market.
Infact, out of all the countries the Camry is sold in, no AWD system for the humble Camry has been developed any where therefore TRD Australia would have had to develope it from scratch to only satisfy a small market hence why it did not come to fruition.
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December 28th, 2007 at 8:05 pm
Great topic, and i got one bright idea.
Which one of these cars mentioned above has great capacity for improvment?.
What iam talking about here is buying yourself a brand new car and taking it to a tuner shop and increasing its improvments by something like 50 to 75% of what it was in the showroom.
I mean people who have money and love for performance cars will have time and money to spend a bit more and smoke off a lot of cars from standing start, not to mention a standard factory vehicles.
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