GM goes turbo
January 29, 2008 by Alborz Fallah
Ford recently shocked the world with its revolutionary idea to turbo-charge its small engines for better fuel economy… the blue oval called the concept EcoBoost. It has been such a brilliant idea, that General Motors has decided to do the same.
Japanese and European turbo fans must be holding back the laughs as the idea of turbo-charging smaller engines for increased performance and lower fuel economy has been around for a good few decades now – so it’s about time the Americans caught up.
To be fair, Ford Australia has been on the ball with the XR6 Turbo and the European Focus imports, Holden too, has done well with the turbo Astra.
However, Ford and GM in the United States have for years simply toyed with the idea of small turbo-charged engines without acting, because the marketing department insisted “they won’t buy a 1.5-litre“.
Currently the smallest engine in a GM car is a 1.6-litre four-cylinder in the Korean-built Chevrolet Aveo, better known here as the Holden Barina.
Nonetheless, it seems that given the state of the economy and rising fuel costs, even the Americans are warming up to smaller engines.
Reports from the States this morning indicate that GM will introduce a turbocharged 1.4-litre petrol engine for a whole range of cars in the U.S. in 2009, with likely candidates including the Saturn Astra (Holden Astra).
“You’re going to see turbocharged four-cylinders in vehicles that no one could have ever imagined that they would be in,” said GM engineering chief Jim Queen.
It is unknown if the engines will be built in the States, Korea or one of GM’s other plants. Regardless of where it all happens, GM’s traditional rival, Ford, is expecting to sell half a million EcoBoost vehicles in North America by 2012, so GM needs to play catch-up.
Experts predict that turbo-charging a mass production car will cost between $200 to $450 USD per vehicle, depending on sophistication.
The big question for us though, is that if GM America is going down the turbo path, is the time nearing for Holden to turbo-charge the mighty Commodore?
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Turbos – Good enough for diesels than why not. If the VW 1.4TSI (Supercharged and Turboed) is as good as I’ve read then it gotta be the way to go. Didn’t the Japanese do a little 800cc turbo motor in some silly little microcar
The Japanese have done really small capacity turbo motors for a fair while now. My favourite is the Subaru Vivio, a supercharged 660cc (hence the name VI VI O for 6-6-0) AWD toy car.
Whats this??
Japan and EU leading the way for GM and Ford…?!
Thats news to me.
Supercujo check out the Suzuki Cappuccino. Now that’s how its done.
could easily have been mainstream a decade ago.(at least?)
Here we go again…
Cut the dramatics out and read the truth and this has nothing to do with turbos being a new idea or not. hello!
This has everything to do with the US vehicle passenger market using turbo power in large numbers and over a broad range of thier of traditional passenger car market.
This is a major shift in typical buying patterns of the American public who love thirsty V8s etc.
This is big news for Ford and GM of North America.
I wonder if Toyota US offers the same passenger and drivetrain lineup as they do in thier European and Asian lineup!? or any other automaker for that matter…
The Daihatsu Charade Turbo was a brilliant piece of kit.
The engine was built with all the best bits – shot peened rods, etc. The boost could be run up to 25psi without hurting the engine internals.
A Ford or GM V8 built with the same good bits inside and running 25psi boost – I’D LIKE TO SEE THAT :)
GM were into turbos before anyone else. Remember the Oldsmobile Cutlass and Chevy Corvair turbos of the early sixties? Wonder if they learned much from this long experience. Probably not.
Yay, more low-power cars that P-platers can’t drive because they are extremely dangerous high-performance machines!
Haha your Mitchell looks like they will have to revise those laws soon enough.
A classic example of US aversion to Turbos is the Nissan 200sx.
In Australia and Japan it is a 2.0L Turbo motor.
In the states they were only released as 240sx a 2.4L n/a Motor – which produced less power.
Those yanks can be silly sometimes.
Yes holden better turbo the SV6 or even make like an XU6 again for a hsv model to be right up there with the typhoon.
You gotta give it to GM – they are awfully slow to come onboard doing what others have been doing for a considerable time beforehand.
Example – unkeen to take onboard hybrid technology but because it is virtually undeniable that we will travel the hybrid path for the interim … GM now decides to come onboard when Toyota and Honda have been doing it for how long …
Unfortunately for GM – the direction the internatioanl motoring industry is heading, it is not in the direction of GM’s most favourable attributes and i find they will struggle increasingly more so at every passing year.
Chris Carter – GM is undoubtedly one of the silliest of them all. Basically GM is moving on with new ideas because they have not not because they want to. A bit like thier attention to ’supposedly’ increased quality control – because of the Japanese they have had to improve because they have to not because thy want to …. it says alot about the inferior culture of the company.
Dingo…
stick to drive.com.au blogs, they suit you better.
Hahahahah Ford and Holden going into Turbos in 2008…. ummmmm bout 10 years to late guys.
TP,
ford had turbos right here in OZ more than 20yrs ago (and holden did too but technically it was nissan) with out even thinking about it.
the bigger picture is that this sort of thing has not been done on a mass scale before.
where is toyota Australias diesel passenger and LPG vehicles?
This is about slapping on a turbo to smaller engines, my laughing is aimed at the fact they are only now looking into this… its to late, Toyota through Lexus are already building performance hybrids while Honda will no doubt be on a good thing with the hydrogen cell. This relates to your last sentnece, where is Ford and Holdens hybrids? The time for Diesel and LPG is over, we are passed that, for now as a minority of people use these alternative fuels its ok but its not sustainable for the entire market given the environmental and energy ‘crisis’ that exists.
The XU6 was crap and even WHEELS special edition HSV mag. said that!
Yes a Turbo SV6 would be good to take on Ford XR6 turbo i guess!
The americans have always been used to big V8’s! Thats why when they here a L3 or L4 1.5 engine or something they probaly go “A weakless little car”! But i guess would’nt want to change all their engines in to L4T. eg. (using ford as an example) If Ford used a turbo charged L4 in there F-Series truck it would be silly but i reckon they should make Turbo V6’s
And GM dont make it in Korea! Please!
yeah duck it may have been then.
But holden/hsv can try change that. every car make has a bad car. and they can try again more power is really what it needs, the rest of the VE’s are good. but the 6’s need more power and if holden do make a XU6 again they may make it good. ya neva no until they try again
Dont get me wrong HOLDEN is good cause im a HOLDEN fan too!
Another miss for HSV was the HSV Jackaroo!
why is now the time for hybrids? because toyota is doing it?
also we’ve been through this greening topic before.
is burning coal to power hybrids in the best interest of the environment?
how can LPG sources for eg not be sustained? did you know that we export billions of litres of the stuff each year and that in addition to that we are also continuously burning it off because we cant use it fast enough.
yes the XU6 was a weird on because it was a reply from holden to the XR6 market that ford had found success in.
perhaps holden didnt put enough into the XU6 or perhaps people just realised that holden 6’s arent the go for the performance minded. it was also quite weird that the supercharged V6 commy’s couldnt even match the power of the stock N/A falcon 6
shit. i didnt no that. yeah holdens 6 is quite shit ayy haha didnt no it was that bad. but holdens v8 is much better then the fords. the xu6 looks nice as and i thort it did go pretty hard 2
Ok Andrew.M LPG is the way…. its going to save the world!!! Why the hell would you go from one non-reneweable to another when the technology exists to reduce their use significantly or completley (hydrogen cell)? You need to get over LPG, if the whole world was using LPG then it would be depleted no doubt very quickly! And thats fogetting the environmetnal cost of going larger scale on its production, offsetting any cost that people try to spin on hybrids
Andrew M, so you reckon we are buring off LPG because we can’t use it fast enough??? Might want to check your facts before you make a fool of yourself.
TP,
LPG is a naturally ocurring gas (or should i say refined/made from)
LPG like hybrids are only a “meanwhile” solution untill the permanent solution presumably in hydrogen comes online
and one main reason you would go from unleaded to LPG is cost. yep to be honest thats on the adgenda of most people not the “apparent” problem with the ozone layer.
LPG is greener than petrol anyhow. dont forget hybrids still use petrol.
also hybrid plugins will simply go from 1 non-renewable source (petrol) to another (coal)
Coal may be the only energy producer in Australia but many other countries use alternative. France has a high number of clean Nuclear paower stations. The UK is aiming at 15% renewables (wind, tidal hydro etc) and of course your neighbours who are good at Rugby New Zealand are big on renewables. Its really only Australia and USA burning mountains of brown coal as is easy and cheap.
Anyway this ain’t about hybrids, its Turbos.
TP… diesel and Hybrids are current technology. The future is Hydrogen and Electric.
Dingo – GM have an advanced Hydrogen R&D programme. they were runing hydorgen powered Zafiras 3-4 years ago. THey are on the pulse. Ford are not better than GM in this respect they have no small turbo cars. If anyone is the leader in turboscharging its the Japanese and Swedes (Saab)
what facts may i check Jbot?
why do you say we arent?
it is a fact that australia has surplus supplies of LPG to our requirement. i say why not use the damn stuff
No, you say we burn it off, which is BS.
Andrew.M you have a fascination with LPG, because your beloved Ford use it… the fact is its far behind Hybrids and alittle bit behind Diesel. On topic, dont you think its a joke they are planning now to make smaller turboed engines? Like come’on, by the time the cars with them get into production Toyota will be selling performance hybrids!
Okay, so GM are late to the party with turbos. A little like Toyota being late to the party with ESP on the Corolla? Or ESP that works effectively on the vehicles already so equipped?
Let them do turbos. Who are we to complain?
TP,
wrong.
i have a fascination with LPG because i have actually used it.
how is LPG behind diesel when LPG vehicles run even cheaper than a hybrid and also that LPG vehicles emitt 90% less particulates than diesels
i think lpg will always be the same with all the car makes. but they need to start really making deisel v8s and other deisels, and hurry up with the hybrid. honda and toyota have for like 2 years and holden and ford say they wont have it until like 2011 or something. way 2 slow 2 react
I’m suprised that after all these comments no one has meantioned that L and P platers won’t be able to drive one of these tiny engines because there’s a hair dryer on the exhaust. But they’ll be allowed to get in dad’s fleet Commodore that makes more power and weights more (note, that’s referring to power output and handling/braking).
Aparently Peugeot are working on a Diesel Hybrid, if not already released it in other parts of the world. I think Hybrid power only works with Diesel. The petrol otto-engine hasn’t really changed in design in over 100 years now. Rather than flog a dead horse, I think it’s time someone like Rudolf Diesel was born and makes a new, revolutionary engine…. then get’s bought out or murdered by oil companies or other car manufacturers. :p
Steve
actually yes P platers were mentioned at the start
Not wrong at all… you are fascinated purely because your beloved Falcons offer it. You claim its so great, well Im sorry but most manufacturers havent invested much into LPG, they have far greater resources to determine if its a viable soltuion… they obviously know it aint!
mmmmm,maybe TP…….but I don’t see Taxi drivers driving Prius’s……………Come on just because one uses it and it works for them,how does that make it a non viable solution ?
TP,
come on mate you have to be kidding yourself if you know my reasons better than myself…..grow up.
i too took a backwards step the first time a salesman uttered the words LPG at me. it was the concept of it being a dedicated fuel system instead of a duel system that grabbed me to look a little further at it.
just cause others arent looking heavily into it doesnt mean it isnt a viable solution. after they are cheaper to run than a hybrid and as i said they emitt 90% less particulates than diesels so i am still waiting to hear how you figure its behind even diesel????
i doubt you have had ZERO interaction with LPG and are scared to look outside what the marketing box is saying. most people i know or have heard from absolutely love LPG once they have used it
so how exactlly is LPG not a viable option?
and im waiting for your reply….(the famously uttered words from you toyota loyals)
Your obviously biased because your LPG crazy… I dont know detailed reasons but as I already said logically if it was such a good thing then it would be in manufacturers best interest to invest into it (especially because LPG is so cheap)… BUT THEY DONT!!! I dont know heaps about LPG, but this is a logical conclusion to make. Other reasons I could guess at is that the higher combustion temps for example reduce engine longetivity, they reduce the power output of vehicles and above all and Id think the main reason, they require more fuel to get the car the same distance (so your talking about LPG which I believe is more scarce then oil… and needing more of it! Ok while some small companies have it, but its not viable as something we can move to from fuel)
TP,
once again just because toyota (and others) are not doing it you see that as your reasoning why it is not a good enough option?
also you have made around 4 incorrect statements about LPG. here are some corrections……..
1. engines on LPG typically last longer
2. engines with a decent LPG system can easily match and in some cases better the power output of the unleaded variants
3. LPG typically offers increased Torque
4. engines with a decent LPG system only drink around 1L more than the petrol versions
5. Australia has a MASSIVE supply of LPG.
what reason makes you think LPG is more scarce?
also im still waiting to hear your thoughts on your confident statement that LPG is behind diesel………
Turbo charged cars go hard and perform well, eg F6 Typhoon vs Falcon GT,a lot of rewiews stated that the F6 out performed the GT because the front end of the car is lighter and the GT’s V8 doesnt get going until 4500 rpm. However, turbo 4s and 6s just dont have that sweet, sweet sound of a thumping huge V8!!!