This term refers to the oil and gas we burn for transport and domestic heating. We currently chew through over 70-80Millon barrels of oil per day @250ltrs per barrel (Approx). The price you pay is based on that demand. If that demand is not sustained the price increases. So the term we’re running out really refers to peak oil. The point where we need oil quicker than we can extract it from the ground. If stats of recent oil discoveries are to be believed we are already at peak oil. So 5 years from now we’re going to see very high oil prices which will continue until its fanancially unviable to extract it.

WE WELL NEVER EVER RUN OUT OF OIL OR GAS!!!!!

your youtube referance has made me see and added bonus to Fuel Cell powered cars. If you put a tap in the fuel line you can fill balloons from the tank. So very unsafe to have a kid wondering around with a balloon full of hydrogen (especially if smokers are presant), but in certain suburbs it will certainly be done.

You also touched on the issue of manufacture of hydrogen. It can be done sustainably (hydro – wind – solar), or tapped from coal feilds or havested from industries that produce it as a bye product. However as we all know human nature, it will most likely be done the cheapest and easyest way useing existing tecnology. Hydrogen derived from hydrocarbons will be disappointing. (if the process turns Natural Gas into hydrogen and diesel it may be worth it for the short term as Australia will be on a winner)

Not going to argue with that statement

My point with the students and their hydrogen ballon bomb, was that it was not even compressed H2. 5000psi is a big deal. At the end of the day even lithium is explosive, so what ever we drive there will be a fire risk somewhere.

Tom, I did respond to you. But my comment is being moderated because the small room at the front of a plane could be deemed a rude word…Good work CA!!

I remember years ago seeing on a TV program (beyond 2000) technology being demonstrated for holding hydrogen in a small tank in a maner that would be relitivly safe in the event of an accident. The tank was ruptured in the presance of a flame, but did not explode. That was well over 10 years ago, so I imagine this technology has been refined more since.

I can see fuel cell – electric hybrids as the most logical evolution for cars in the longer term future. This doesn’t mean that it will happen as our spiecies isn’t exactly governed by logic.

It amuses me that EV proponents have the same attitudes towards technological development as the EV naysayers did a few years ago, when it comes to fuel cells.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMB2VR0087w

Now consider the Honda FCX tank which is compressed to 350bar or (5000Psi). At that pressure if the tank fails in an accident your going to have a bad day

I think fuel cells have their place in areospace and energy generation, like using excess solar power generated during the day. Converting to H2 then back to electricity at night. But for automotive its just not sustainable enough. The well-to-wheel ratio is just too loo compared to a BEV.

In some parts of the world you could use that as advertising FOR fuel cell cars! Wasn’t there an American Oil company using the slogan “a Tiger in your Tank” in the 70′s or 80′s?

Hydrogen is a much missunderstood element. Most people panic and think of the Hindenberg when you talk about the stuff and cars. The way the Hindenburg Burnt had a lot to do with the aluminium and canvas that was visable burning. Its worth remembering that quite a few people survived that crash ( an Areoplane full of AV Gas would had had few if any survours )

Hydrogen itself burns with a clear flame and the heat does not radiate (this makes Hydrogen fires a bugger to spot without getting burnt). If hydrogen leaks its lighter than air properties means it tends to asend, not expand outwards like LPG.

The ideal Fuel Cell arangement would be a Fuel Cell -
Battery set up with the fuel cell generating power to keep the batteries topped up and the car running off the batteries. This would be simular to the way modern Diesel – Electric submarines work, There is even a type of Submarine under development that will be Diesel – Fuel Cell – Electric (Germany – type 212 I think).

Worth watching to see where this Tech evolves.

Thats a bit aggressive Frenchie, you been hitting the expresso machine a bit hard or what

Sorry the quoted price was for Lithium Carbonate which is one of the key ingredients for lithium-ion batteries. I doubt lithium metal would be $600USD per Kg, that sounds very high to me.

“but at the moment H2 is a more reliable, lighter energy storage solution than batteries. Batteries storage capacity depletes over time, so bigger batteries mean bigger waste.”

How can you deem H2 to be reliable when there are no H2 cars available to buy? Doesn’t that tell you something? Battieries can be recycled and don’t involve you driving around with a compressed Hydrogen bomb in your tank.

Every piece of empirical evidence from every leading scientific organisation in the world says that we are causing it. If you don’t believe me, all you have to do it is type “global warming” into google, look at a few graphs, read a few reports, and it is as clear as anything.

But somehow, you guys know something everyone else doesn’t? And you know, even if you are right, it doesn’t make sense for us to keep consuming, wasting, and using nonrenewable resources.

Good on you for standing by your beliefs, but unfortunately, you are flogging a dead horse. A very dead horse, the skeletal remains of a horse, no, the DNA of the dust of where the horse died 10,000 years ago.