Fog Light Fury
June 11, 2007 by Paul Maric
I’ve had this boxed up inside me for some time now and it can’t remain any longer, I have to share with everyone my Fog Light Fury.
Most middle of the range cars now come with fog lights, along with a bucket load of DIY maestros who fit their own fog lights, caring little about their alignment and positioning.
During total daylight, without even an ounce of darkness, you are likely to find no less that one in five people driving with their fog lights on – that’s according to my personal day-to-day tally. Unbeknown to the driver, their fog lights are pissing me – and quite a few other road users – right off. Is there any logic whatsoever in using your fog lights during the day, or even during the night when there is absolutely NO fog around? Absolutely not.
Drivers that have mis-aligned fog lights manage to get at me the most, surely if they knew how bloody annoying and dangerous their showboating attempt was, they would realise that there is absolutely no logic in the use of their fog lights. Earlier model Subaru WRXs, along with VT-VZ Commodores must be the worst offenders, every single one of them – with fog lights on – seems to have their fog lights aligned directly at oncoming traffic.
And then there are rear fog lights…Hyundai Excels anyone? Rear fog lights are the bane of all evil and should not – under any circumstances – be operated during conditions where there is no fog! Surely drivers of these offending vehicles wonder what the little red fog light symbol on their dashboard means?! Unbeknown to them, they are irritating the absolute crap out of everyone else. They are subtle enough not to stand out at first, but the second you notice them, your eyes don’t drift away until they’re gone.
My rant does serve a purpose. It is in fact illegal to operate fog lights and rear fog lights during conditions where there is no fog. Unfortunately, Police are always too busy doing other things, opposed to booking serial offenders who think their fog lights somehow impress other drivers.
So next time your finger goes for that fog light switch – STOP. Because you are annoying the crap out of every other motorist on the road.
- Paul Maric
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I AM KING..HEAR ME ROAR. TO ALL THOSE TOSSERS HAVING A WHINGE ABOUT PPL DRIVING WITH FOG LIGHTS ON. IF THEY ARE ILLEGAL TO HAVE ON IN THE DAY OR NIGHT, WHY DO THE BLOODY CAR MANUFACTURERS PUT THEM ON CARS. THEY CANT CONTROL HOW DRIVERS USE THEM.ITS JUST LIKE THAT STUPID LAW WITH P PLATERS NOT ALLOWED TO DRIVE A TURBO CHARGED CAR. SO MANY OF THEM HAVE A TURBO CAR. Y CANT THE COPZ ENFORCE THAT LAW? BECAUSE THERE ARE FAR TO MANY P PLATERS WITH A TURBO. ITS THE SAME WITH FOG LIGHTS. WHAT COP WOULD BE STUFFED TO PULL OVER A CAR WITH FOG LIGHTS ON. THEY WOULD BE DOING THAT ALL BLOODY DAY! THIS COUNTRY IS FULL OF STUPID PPL COMPLAINING ABOUT THE MOST STUPIDEST THINGS IN LIFE LIKE FOG LIGHTS. WHO GIVES A SHIT ABOUT FOG LIGHTS. THERES NOTHING UNSAFE ABOUT LIGHTS. ITS THE SAME WITH POWER. PPL CRY OVA HIGH SPEED CRASHES, MAINLY FOCUSED ON YOUNG DRIVERS. ITS NOT THE KW OUTPUT OF AN ENGINE ITS THE STUPID DECISIONS MADE BY THE STUPID DRIVER WHICH RESULTS IN THEIR CRASH, NOT THE CAR. BUT PPL ARE SO THICK HEADED AND FOLLOW THE STUPID SUPPOSEDLY ROAD LAWS (which are meant to make our roads safer, which they do not) MADE BY OUR CORRUPT AUSTRALIAN GOVERNMENT.JUST LOOK AT THESE STUPID NEW GREEN P-PLATER LAWS WHICH COME OUT JULY 1. THEY SAY A GREEN P-PLATER MAY ONLY CARRY 1 PASSENGER. WILL THAT MAKE OUT ROADS SAFER? NO!! IT WILL JUST PUT MORE IDIOTIC YOUNG DRIVERS ON THE ROAD AND CAUSE MORE CRASHES AS YOUNG PPL THINK THEY ARE KING DICK ON THE ROAD AND KNOW HOW TO DRIVE. A LOT OP POLICE AGREE WITH THIS, AND BECAUSE ITS A MINORITY OF THEM, THEIR VOICES AREN’T HEARD. THE CORRUPT GOVERNMENT CHOOSES TO DO WHAT I CALL, SELECTIVE HEARING. SO SCREW SWITCHING FOG LIGHTS OFF UNTIL CAR MAKERS STOP PUTTING THEM ON CARS.
Oh look everybody ERVO has learnt how to copy and paste…. He has come out of the stone age.
Thanks Mambosau for the heads up on the introduction in QLD. I will look forward to the day when that becomes law.
If someone has more information on when and how this will be adopted in QLD could you please post it here.
Thanks
And before anyone points out the error.I meant to say EVRO.
It is just idiots like him that increase the road toll in this country.
I agree with those two guys up who say, what’s the point of arguing about Foglights, when there are people who CONTINUOUSLY, fail to give way, speed up to cut you off from changing lanes, fail to indicate, indicate when they don’t need to, when turning right/left are in the MIDDLE of the lane (which by law is technically illegal as it should be as close to the side they are turning to). People who park really close to driveways, traffic lights, intersections (which is also illegal, there are measurements in the law).
How many people here can say they’ve never done these?
Funnily enough, they’re all part of the law as well as common sense and yet are continuously broken…
Rob, I will agree with you about the fact that there are a lot of other road rules that are broken. But I have to say that these fog lights are being turned on buy an ever increasing number of people. Every night I would have at least two dozen of them blinding me on my way home. Some of them in new cars are better than my old driving lights I use to have on my LH.
The sooner some of these wankers get a fine for their trouble the better.
They are almost as bad as push bike rider,,, But that is another matter.
Evro, you are so right
“WHAT COP WOULD BE STUFFED TO PULL OVER A CAR WITH FOG LIGHTS ON. THEY WOULD BE DOING THAT ALL BLOODY DAY!…………THERES NOTHING UNSAFE ABOUT LIGHTS…….ITS NOT THE KW OUTPUT OF AN ENGINE ITS THE STUPID DECISIONS MADE BY THE STUPID DRIVER WHICH RESULTS IN THEIR CRASH, NOT THE CAR.”
I’m not sure i could have explained it better, nobody here is having a cry about that car manufacturers are putting unsafe Lights on cars….we are voicing our discust about those “STUPID DRIVERS” as you sooooo politely have put it, that insist on using a very usefull ‘tool’ at the wrong time in the wrong place…. but i guess you would be someone that’s brainy enough to use a match to check your petrol tank to see how much fuel is left in there……
I’ve been a NSW police officer performing Highway Patrol duties for almost 20 years, and I have watched the amount of fog lights being fitted standard on new vehicles increase exponentially over the last 8 or so years, and their unlawful usage increase at the same rate. I have gotten sick of telling people to turn them off at night (not so much worried about day) when conditions dont allow their use (can only be used in conditions of decreased visibility-fog, mist and heavy rain), but I have been more after other things to take up my time giving out tickets for it. All the warnings and such however of my colleagues and I seem not to have stemmed the tide, and it seems that it is the No. 1 gripe of respondents to a recent NRMA survey, so now I am going to set up by the roadside one night and book every car with them on. It wont take long before I run out of tickets. Am I a bastard? Some might think so, but I have tried the other option and it doesnt work. I dont make any more money out of this and when I give each ticket out, it will be for myself as a road user, and all the other motorists out there who do the right thing and are sick of it.
People dont seem to understand that although some fog lights are little more than a gimmick, many others are extremely powerful, and can have about 2-4 times the power of a low beam headlight. Although the beam of a fog light is not focussed, and generally pointed down and out to the side, if you happen to approach a car with them on when they are misaligned after an accident repair, the car is cresting a rise or hill, or the lights are pointing up due to the car towing or carring a load, the efect can be blinding, and it is fatiguing to the driver being repetitively blinded by each and every passing car.
By all means, the more light the better to see as well as possible, and drive safely, but not with fog lights to the detriment of other road users. Most people are courteous and obey the law when it comes to high beam usage, and they need to do the same with fog lights. I wont even go there with the idiots that drive at night with no headlights but fog lights. Sure we can see them, and get blinded by them, but these idiots cant themselves see adequately when their fog lights only adequately light up less than a car length ahead of them. Thats two tickets for them in that. And all in the name of looking cool. Funnily enough, most of them have a little red or green P on their cars.
Wow this is such a controversial subject. I’m 25 and a SV6 Commodore driver… That means I should be cool and drive around with my driving lights on like ‘cool dude’… I think not.
I can MORE than relate to the reaction of people cursing them If you have them on in the day, with or without your main lights on, you are a complete tool… No other way to describe it. Night time passing on country roads or in built up towns/citys where it is worse with blonde barbies in Yaris’s and Excels adding to the trend with rear fog lights, it’s frigging annoying…Even looking away (as much as you can), they still bork your vision. You don’t look cool, you don’t go faster so GET OVER IT. I have used mine only a handful of times since having my current car (dec.06), becuase it’s not really needed. So wogafied doof doof’s use them in fog or on country roads when no one is around if you have really feel the need to use them and look cool.
Driving with your main lights on in the day on the other hand, I can not see a problem with. They don’t irritate anyone else or cuase problems. I have mine set so they come on when I unlock the car, and stay on whilst driving till the car is locked again. I do about 50,000kms per year, so it’s a safety thing as much as convenience. I honestly can’t understand why people whinge at this tho.
I’m worried that these poor people can’t see, especially people with their rear foglights so I always make sure I add as much lighting as is possible for these poor people, high beam and driving lights and all, sick of these selfish single cells…. if all else fails excellent target practice……. idiots idiots idiots
evro ervo whoever you are… make sure you leave your high beams on, your heater etc whatever else is in the car, turn it all on at anytime….. and use all 50kw or 500kw of your car obviously not using much else as far as your physiology and anatomy is concerned…. very entertaining – total besccheuert….. hope you use your airbag too!
you high beam people to tell them they left their high beams on
nothing wrong with having the same system with fog lights
then one day these drivers using fog lights illegally would realise why now and then oncoming drivers high beam them
same to drivers with incorrect head or fog light alignments
Factory fitted fog lights are No brighter than general head lights. This comes under the manufacturing requirements of motor vehicles and compliance acts.
In addition the angle of the fog lights is for aiming under the fog and not at the eye level of drivers.
It is common people misunderstand the difference between fog lights and driving lights. Also driving lights are only activated with the high beam switch. Fog lights are only activated with parking or general driving lights (if they are factory fitted).
The main issue is aftermarket fitment. This could be regulated by yearly inspection (pink slip).
IT IS AN ABSOLUTE MYTH that fog lights blind drivers any more than GENERAL LOW BEAM lights unless misaligned. They have no higher wattage and the glass is frosted tinted or diffused. Misalignment as an issue is no different for general low beam.
The most unfortunate issue is simple minded people are always looking for some issue to complain about and have no idea of the real facts or Physics on the matter and start making false claims.
Wake up and quantify your research before spinning BS Bloggs!
lighting authority, what rock r u living under and exactly what makes you an authority on the issue. Obviously you haven’t seen the fog lights in use on the latest model mid range falcons, commodores or subarus, I,d suggest you open your eyes next time you’re out at night. As an authority on the issue i would expect you to know that the glass used in these lights is, more often than not, CLEAR. Also, if it is an ABSOLUTE MYTH(tried quantifiably researching but couldnt find any entries on this)that these lights are no brighter than general low beam as you state, why is the queensland government, along with many others, adopting and enacting current national legislation in the near future to prevent these inconsiderate tools from dazzling other drivers. As for physics maybe you should think before you type because last time i checked four lights are brighter, therefore more dazzling than two, regardless of where they are aimed, the size of the bulb and type of lens. It seems you are offended by some of the comments here which possibly suggests you are one of these tools who derive great pleasure from using your wanker lights at all times regardless of the weather and impact to other road users. Simple minds, no idea, quantifying research……….hmmmmmmm. At least the government is acting to protect us from people like yourself…. note to self WAKE UP
Two points.
1. In Victoria at least, use of fog lights without fog is illegal.
2. If you have an accident while using them illegally, your insurance company doesn’t have to pay out. Same as non road worthy car, talking on mobile, or over 0.05% alcohol level.
So if you use them illegally, you are not a wanker, you are a retarded wanker.
4WD’s are more of a pain, because they are lot higher than my VT Commodore Wagon and shine through easily and brightly then lower or 2WD cars.
Lighting authority-You have correctly stated there are rules specifically for fog light design/etc (ADR 50/00) These however really only use measuring tests for aim to reduce dazzle. The ADR also provides for “subjective” assessment for dazzle based on light output in conjunction with aim also. They are more concerned with aim than output and there is NO specific maximum level for power output whether it be lumens,watts, whatever. Under the conditions of ADR 50/00, manufacturers can provide the vehicle and fitting with a standard bulb for testing, and then later in production can and do fit a bulb that provides 5-6 times as much light output and this still meets the ADRs. Information from laboratories used by manufacturers to test ADR compliance is that this ADR is rarely used/compliance is not tested for, and seems to be self regulated.
Currently only the power consumption of rear fog lights is limited (to 27 watts) under RTA design rules, and even then wattage is an outmoded method of measurement as it is concerned with power consumption, not light output.
Not all fog lights are the same. Heres an exercise-When you out and about, look for a Holden Commodore SS, VT model. This model was the first Holden mainstream model to be generally fitted with fog lights. If you se its fog lights on, they are pretty well insignificant. Compare that to a VZ or later SS Commodore and you will definitely see the difference. I have no idea of their wattage and perhaps both might use 55 watt bulbs, but the light output of each is chalk and cheese, and the VZ or later fog light is very hight on the dazzle scale when used in clear conditions.
I have not been back on here for a while abd to return to read some of the total B.S. by a couple of the posters is most disturbing.
For Lighting Authority to state that”Factory fitted fog lights are No brighter than general head lights” goes to show just how stupid he really is. If you have one light and you add another and another and another does it not get brighter? Doh!!! I think you should go back to watching someone with the same brain power “Homer”
Bruce, dipped headlights are not bright, nor in the least bit annoying. Yes, having a lot of these could theoretically get annoying. But I have yet to experience this, even when driving down dual carriageways with hundreds of oncoming cars – all with dipped headlights. By your logic I should probably have suffered permanent blindness.
Decent fog lights appear from the front just like dipped headlights. Unless you’re laying on the road looking up at them, you won’t see any direct light from them. Harmless. Yes, a lot of cars (like the wrx pictured) seem to more so have offroad/rally style lights marked as “fog lights” – these are hazardous and serve no real purpose. Similarly rear foglights.
Hi all,
I have a VY HSV any have been stopped 1 at night and ywice during the day for fog lights, now that said i totally agree with in-appropriate use of fog light during the night when there is no inclement weather, it shits me as well, now during the day i always drive with my headlights on, however i prefer to use my fog lights during the day becasue they have a brighter globe and i wont cry if i blow a globe on them, the law states and i quote: ” only 2 forward facing white light are to be on at any one time, however if they ” cause dazzle” to oncomming traffic day or night then it is illegal.
1 Fog light + low beam = double the light (for you and the poor bastard coming the other way.
2 Don’t mind people using them as day lights.
3 I’m sure a lot have bigger globes or have been reaimed.
4 All car builders should be made to recall vechiles and fit a cutout on fog lights when lights are on.
5 (bright 4wd lights) bet most of them are 100 series cruisers with stacked headlight where low beam is the top light. Tried adjusting mates cruiser because he was being flashed without much success.
As of 16th April 2008 a new law regarding the use of front fog lights was announced. Minister for roads, Tim Pallas, said that using front fog lights in any other conditions apart from hazardous weather conditions was now prohibited.
The new law brings the use of front fog lights under conditions which are not foggy or hazardous they could face fines of about $120.It can be even more of a fine if parker lights are on with fog lights on as well. This apply s to Victoria only at this stage.
Have you considered that some people use fog lights as a less-dazzling (than standard headlights) way of making their vehicles more visible in overcast or low-light conditions (I’m not talking about night time, standard headlights work fine for night time)?
Just because you’re not concerned about how visible you are to other road users, doesn’t mean everyone else is doing this for vanity reason. Jump off your high horse.
John, fog lights are only less dazzling than your normal headlights when they are facing down. As soon as you hit a bump, or cross a hill and they flick up to catch oncoming cars at eye level, they are much brighter than standard headlights. Thats why they shouldn’t be used unless it is foggy, and you have fog to reduce the intensity of the light. You might have good intentions for using them, doesn’t mean its not inconsiderate to other uses however.
John,
The facts are, they are illegal, in victoria at least.
If you have an accident while using them you will be as liable as if you were over .05 or had bald tyres etc. And you have voided your insurance, if you have it. Your choice.
What I don’t get is manufacturers only fit them for the asthetics, ie for the rally race car look.
Why then don’t they fit something that is actually usefull, like daytime running lights?
And does replacing the globes with a low output (eg 20W) make them safer/legal? – I do doubt it, but maybe that’s an idea that should be presented to the authorities.
I drive with my driving lights on all the time, i can actually see where im going then. Last night was the first a cop had ever said anything, altho i switched them back on 50meters up the road
Euro cars with their HID lights are way more annoying then any “driving light” or those wannabe HID’s
driving lights….i was driving at the time i was using them?.
Dear Paul
In regards to your letter above.
A new study has found that if you drive with your lights on during the day, there is a 20% less chance of having a head on accident.
Don’t ask me how that works, but i recently took a Defensive Drivers course and they repeated that a number of times.
I now drive with my lights on ALL the time, day or night.
Tyler
Interesting point Tyler.
Did they explain the difference between low beam, DRL’s (daytime running lights) and fog/driving lights?
MICK wrote:
“Last night was the first a cop had ever said anything, altho i switched them back on 50meters up the road”.
A good reason why ‘no mercy’ should be shown by highway patrol in relation to this offence. That the offence also needs to attract a demerit point or two.
It is clear, late comers do not read other key posts.
TYLER: You are discussing DRL’s which are on a 12volt vehicle 21watt bulbs (akin to a reverse lamp or cornering lamp in power), front fog lamps, white-optic or ’selective yellow’ are 55w and have an utterly different light characteristic designed for specific weather purpose.
Now, IF we are to mandate DRL’s (stuffed why in an environment such as OZ), we should then set about mandating a *genuinely safety focussed* item for new market vehicles, namely; “rear fog lamps” (requires a change at ADR13, Part 8.5.1) – because a cars standard taillights (a mandatory item, duh) are utterly worthless in even moderate rain in daylight when on a freeway or other high speed road, or when caught in torrential rain – day or night, in heavy fog, or if caught in bushfire smoke conditions et al.’
ATM these are, as a sign of sheer ‘dumb’ (and actionable) regulatory negligence; ‘optional fitment’.
THEN we should set about what has been achieved in Europe on two fronts; that is, mandating that all cars, vans and 4WD’s be required to carry a single “hazard-warning triangle” to Euro specification, a specification that is now up for world adoption as “UNECE 27R” in the UN Road Traffic Convention.
We then should adopt the requirement for at least ONE supplied “high-visibility safety vest” in cars, van and 4WD’s categories, again up for world adoption, – for use by the roadside at breakdowns and crash scenes.
A matter of time, the driver manuals of TAS, WA, QLD, NSW, SA, ACT suggest their use, and some such as the NSW RUH and TAS versions even include pics of each item, ‘to plant the seed’.
EN471 vests, GB:-
http://solutions.3m.co.uk/wps/.....mportance/
French Vest and Triangle requirement now meets other EU requirements (See also Pdf):-
http://www.thisfrenchlife.com/.....iangl.html
We could of course do bugger all. You can buy an EU/UN spec triangle in AUS for as little as $20 (Supplier PRO-KIT, Item No.RG9212), and an EN471 spec vest for $5-7. (Hot dollar shops). Better than been run down by those that simply cannot see or are otherwise distracted.
NB: The only “fog lamp” that is regulated as mandatory anywhere in the world, is the REAR fog lamp, since expert know a cars low-beam is sufficient for much of the weather we experience, and recognises that a rear fog lamp IS the “primary defence” against having someone impact the rear of your car when under crappy visibility.
Some of the people posting on this site are saying there is not a problem with using FOG lights all of the time.
OK if there is not a problem why does this blog exist?
If you need proof that FOG lights dazzle other road users
just take a look at the 2 pictures at the beginning of this blog. Why are the pro FOG light users even reading this blog unless they know there is a problem?
A new law regarding the use of front fog lights was also announced today. April 16 2008. Victoria
Minister for Roads and Ports, Tim Pallas, said that using front fog lights in any other conditions apart from hazardous weather conditions was now prohibited.
“Fog lamps turned on when there is no fog can cause glare, affecting other road users’ ability to see and drive safely,” Mr Pallas said.
“The new law brings the use of front fog lights in line with rules for using rear fog lights, reflecting community expectations and improving road safety.
“If drivers use their fog lights under conditions which are not foggy or hazardous they could face fines of $116.”
Tony,
You are correct, it is illegal.
Last week I saw a learner driver in an RACV driving school car, with the fog lights on, and no fog.
What more can I say.
Steve
For fog lamps to be effective, they are designed to project a wide beam, both to the left and right of the car, for the purpose of picking up the road edges on both the left and right side of the car in white out conditions. This wide beam is what can dazzle oncoming drivers.
Also Modern low beam headlights have an unsymmetrical pattern and have a sharp cut off on the drivers side of the vehicle.
I have to say Tony, I have read this blog while researching “How” it became illegal to drive a vehicle with so called “Fog” lights on. And Wow…. what an adverse set of options. Well to all the anti “foggers” I have absoltely no problems with drivers with their ‘Fog’ lights on (illegal or legal). I have many hours of driving at night and any vehicle (truck, van, car, 4X4, SUV etc)that have their ‘Fog’ light(s)on that’s just fantastic and if the driver wants them on during the day that’s fine also.
Having read many bloggers stating how the ‘Fog’ light(s) has a wider beam then normal headlights and as this may be the truth, it has never bothered me. I have learnt over the years of night driving with on coming of traffic to focus way from the vehicles headlights (and what have you) and to the left verge of the road. This way one can focus on where one is driving rather then being concerned with the on coming vechicles light status.
When driving in day or night one needs the drive defensively and not ‘Offensively’ – that means, to do what you have to do to protect yourself and the person in the on coming vehicle from any form of injury etc. Yes the other driver may be making a mistake but don’t you or me add to that mistake by creating a dangerous situition causing jury to yourself and the other person. Unfortunately I get the impression from many ‘Anti’ Foglighters are bent causing harm, this is where ‘ROAD RAGE’ becomes a real problem. Get a grip on reality and get your rage off the roads and away from other humans, get some help for your disposition.
Now for the confession – I like to drive with my ‘Fog’ lights ON. I have noticed from observing other on coming vehicles (this includes city / town driving) this makes the vehicle very prominent and obvious so I personally consider it to be a plus for safety.
From a legal point of view, if I get sprung by a law officer, I’ll have to wear the fine but I’ll do my best to argue that this law is trivial and is more to do with venue raising for governments more then to do with logical sense (of cause many of you ‘ANTI’ foglighters want see it that way – so be it).
Have a great day and drive safely.
I think all the pathetic excuses for disobeying the law that Nath brings up have been well covered already, but since Nath is incapable of reading the previous posts, it needs to be spelt out again:
1. Whether people like Nath are capable of maintaining their vision while cretons driving in the opposite direction aim spotlights at them is irrelevant, we are not all super human. Misaimed headlights are a hazard to night driving for sure and I wish more was done about it, however, it doesnt justify adding to the problem by putting your wank lights on.
2. Sure having lights on during the day may decrease your chance of having an accident. There is no study to suggest that they have to be fog lights, headlights on low beam will do the job just fine!. We dont need a battery of blinding lights to know you are coming.
Thanks Isaac – To put the record straight buddy I have read and was amused by the above posts and since you just want to be arrogant than I will say, you never read nor understood my post… it’s called readers tunnel vision….
Personally I am doing what I can to undo this ridiculous law as it only appears to be a few uneducated drivers (but very vocal ones unfortunately) who appear have problem with so called fog lights.
Have a nice day all – and I’ll wave to you all in my 4×4 with my fog lights on…… Had to rub that in….
I was out and about last night, Friday 26th June, in the Granville Silverwater Homebush area. I must have seen 8 cars with rear fog lights on. OK maybe the use of front fogs can be justified but rear fogs are not a fashion statement. Funny how annoyed they get when you sit behind them with your high beam on. If you have a car fitted with rear fogs please look for the switch and turn the #&*@*^ things off.
Good on you nath, why do we have this “ridiculous law”?
The same reason we have many other “ridiculuous laws”!
To protect the public from those who are ignorant, stupid and/or have no regard for the safety of others, such as yourself.
Laws are only brought in when it becomes apparent a certain % of the population just dont get it, like wearing seat belts or not using a mobile while driving. Fog lamps 30 years ago were a rare accessory and only purchased by those that drove in alpine areas and understood when thei use was appropriate, there didnt need to be a law written out just like we dont need a law telling people not to drive around in suburbia with snow chains on. Now we have the lamps on all sorts of vehicles and unfortunately there are dimwits that think the lights are there to either make the vehicle look cool or give them better vision on suburban roads, or the braindead reason you give of people “will see me when Im shining my lights in their eyes”.
I have little sympathy for those that get fined/apprehended for using their lamps on the basis they didnt know it was illegal/didnt realise they were on/every one else does it, with driving a vehicle comes responsibilities. In your case, however, I have nothing but contempt, you know its against the law, you’ve been given irrefutable reasons as to why its dangerous, but you have taken it upon yourself to disregard that based on “you dont mind”. Society needs less morons like you.
IMHO Fog lights / Driving lights are no more startling or distracting to other drivers than the Premium High Intensity Discharge [HID] or Xenon style lights that are gradually becoming more and more common on cars these days.
If your car came with them fitted as STANDARD [and not an option or fitted aftermarket] then you should be allowed to use them.
Having said that I don’t see the point in those rearward facing fog lights you see on some Japanese/Korean cars though
Wheelnut says: “If your car came with them fitted as STANDARD [and not an option or fitted aftermarket] then you should be allowed to use them”
Great logic wheelnut, if you read through all the posts that stupidity has already been countered. According to you we should be able to drive with the high beams on at any time too?
Some cars have misaligned or too bright headlights so why worry about fog lamps, ah yes, the two wrongs make a right logic.
Thanks Wheelnut,
I have just seen the light. (pun intended)
I will now make myself “safer” by driving with high beam, emergency flashers and horn all running. That should be ok because these came as STANDARD on my car.
Hey Steve feel free to do so,but I think you will distract drivers a hell of lot more than Foggies do. If you want to stand out that much join the emergency service ,their lights come with pretty red and blue colours :)
As Wheelnut said ,in his opinion ” Fog lights / Driving lights are no more startling or distracting to other drivers than the Premium High Intensity Discharge [HID] or Xenon style lights”
If you think your FOG lights should be on even if it is a crystal clear night try this little experiment.
Get yourself a laser pen and try and light up the road,
not much good, now turn it around and shine it in your eyes.
Painful?
NZ Drivers are dumb. There are 2 kinds: 1. buys a European car and turns the light switch on, gets the headlights working… but hang on – there is something else here, another light symbol that I can turn on (the front fog lights) cool… and hang on mate, another symbol and this time it’s an orange one on my dashboard (the annoyingly bright rear foglight, usually just on one side of vehicle) – cool, look at me I’ve got it worked out – even though I’m not at all sure what I just switched on – hey there are some people flashing their lights at me but NAH, I’m a kiwi in a new Euro car, had to re-mortgage my house to get it and my kids have white bread with marmite for school lunches all year but here I am – the dazzling KING OF THE ROAD. 2. Buys a Japanese car that has everything copied from the European models last year, it’s called Toyota Gina Preceed Fury Explore Bounty Jammo LXT GXY Mark 16 and this time the fog lights are HUGE, they are bigger than the actual headlights and off he goes, down the Gt North Rd, all the lights on he can find + an air freshener.
It’s all just another part of dumb kiwi car obsession even though it totally defies common sense.
FOG LIGHTS FOR FOG CONDITIONS – could it be simpler?
PS. If you drive in continental Europe and you have your foglights switched on during normal weather you are likely to get pulled over by a cop.
Sorry, forgot about you dudes that buy those ugly Aussie petrol guzzling monsters – you are the same as type 2 even though your kids have white bread for lunch because you think that’s health food.
Cheers!
Here in the good ole USA a lot of people drive around with their DRIVING lights on all of the time. These are ultrabright and generally poorly aimed. I guess over here they don’t need to be wired so that they can only run with the high-beams on (as a side note, fog lights must be wired to turn off when the high beams are on in most states, but allowed with normal headlights). During the day it is only idiotic show-offsmanship, at night, in the curvey mountainous country roads it is damn dangerous.
I stumbled upon this thread while researching fog & driving lights, as I want to improve the lighting on my car. The backroads are VERY dark around here. We also get a fair amount of thick fog. I lot of people sell crap around here (even internationally known name-brands make crap), so I wanted some solid info so as to not waste money.
my findings:
As I always thought, fog lights are for use in fog. The cast a low wide “beam” to show the sides fo the road & the area immediately in front of you. For low speed use. Yellow was used 70 years ago due to the science of the day as far as refraction, we know better now. It still might make sense regarding on-coming traffic being able to see you better.
Driving lights are for improved nightime rural driving & should be (everywhere in the civilized world (that does, by default, exclude the US)) linked to the high-beams.
Is driving with lights brighter than the sun the most dangerous thing people do behind the wheel? NO. But it is dangerous & worthy of an internet thread (& regulation).
I see a lot of this going on:
Speeding up in foul weather. The more foul, the faster. They have to prove how fast they can go on ice & snow covered roadways (usually end up passing these people again when their car is stopped by a tree 50′ off the road).
45mph in an active (busy) parking lot – than the same person will do 55mph on the expressway (with a 65mph speed limit) unless its in a construction zone, then its 70mph with a 55 mph speed limit.
Tailgate.
Aggresively tailgate.
Drive like complete maniacs – no need for details.
Speed up to red lights.
Slow down for green lights.
Sorry for my rant, but a lot of Americans don’t know how to drive.
Driving with fog lights on at times of no fog is illegal and offensive. Commodore, Falcon, and Subaru owners please note that you are the worst offenders on the roads, you DO NOT look good, you are only proving just how ignorant and offensive YOU are. Other road users do not like you and the fact that one person has already been bashed to death in this country because of fog lights should tell you something. While I do not condone this, as a professional driver I see it all day, every day. Lets look at changing vehicle standards and have fog lights banned from ALL locally built and imported vehicles including trucks and buses.
It is clear this piece has somewhat deteriated
Shermann said” I have a 150W Hella orange spot mounted on the parcel shelf aimed right at you when you flash your stupid high beam at me”.
Wankers like these are the issue with tis country. I bet you Shermann is driving slow as a dead donkey annoying the crap out ootyher drivers. So when someone flashes him he feels offended? Why becuase it is clear someone is ponting out his inability to drive and causing safety concernes for all road users around him. So Sherman instead of wasting time/money (it is clear you a repeat wanker who can;t drive whihc has been poited out by multiple people flashing you) – sell your light and spend the money on driving lessons – ignoramous!!!
Back to the issue – fog lights during the day when there is low light (such as sun hidden by clouds) fog light especially rear ones can be quite dazzling. Even during rain and other low light condition rear fog lights are also dazzling. As such the law states use fog lights only during fog – which is how it should be.
All I can hope is this is a windup,:Shermann said” I have a 150W Hella orange spot mounted on the parcel shelf aimed right at you when you flash your stupid high beam at me”.
but if its for real I sincerely hope that the practice is detected by law enforcement and vermin like Shermann is removed from the roads before someone gets hurt.
I found this thread so interesting I thought I should comment. I’ve been driving on Australian roads for 10+ years and have never been “dazzled” by front mounted fog lights! Is this really a problem? I see Subaru and Holden drivers running their stock, front, fog lamps as daytime running lights all the time, and I’ve never once had any trouble with them. In fact, I’ve always thought they increased the visibilty of the vehicle and were a superb safety enhancer (increased visibility). Especially given there are so many silver and dark grey cars on the road doing their best to blend in.
Is it so common for other drivers to be dazzled by them? I don’t think I’ve ever seen a set powerful enough to acheive such a result. I know the fog lights on my Gen3 (1999) Outback couldn’t be used as a reading light! Certainly street lights are more dazzling. At any angle my fog lights are the equivilent of dim daytime running lights, at best!
All that said, I can’t agree more about rear fog lamps being a hinderance in Oz. I think the “dazzle” argument is a farse, but they do decrease the effectiveness of the braking light signals, as in many cases it seems like the driver is braking constantly, and when they do actually brake, the contrast of this added brightness (usually only one side) is vastly diminished. There’s nothing worse.