Toyota forecasts US$4.95 billion loss
February 7, 2009 by David Twomey
Plunging sales in North America and Europe have prompted Toyota Motor Corporation to offer its gloomiest yet forecast, projecting an annual loss three times greater than earlier suggested.
At the same time it said it was looking to cut $5.5 billion in cost, including from its research and development and marketing budgets .
The world’s largest carmaker now says its first annual operating loss in seven decades will be ¥450 billion (US$4.95 billion) for the financial year that ends March 31.
The deteriorating outlook, included in a third-quarter report, comes just six weeks after Toyota scrapped a forecast for a fiscal year profit and projected a $1.65 billion operating loss.
The carmaker said it expects its global sales to tumble 17.87 per cent to 7.32 million units. That’s against December’s forecast of 7.54 million vehicles and last year’s tally of 8.91 million.
Toyota also will record its first annual net loss since 1950: $3.85 billion. That contrasts with last year’s $18.9 billion net profit.
Toyota’s US sales plunged 15.4 per cent in 2008 compared with 2007, while overall US sales fell 18.0 per cent. Last month, Toyota sales slipped an additional 31.7 per cent, while overall US sales collapsed 37.1 percent.
At the same time, the yen’s rapid surge against a weakening US dollar lopped billions more off company profits.
“As the business expanded, there may be certain issues we didn’t pay enough attention to,” Executive Vice President Mitsuo Kinoshita said, in a rare admission of business error, while announcing results.
The story for Toyota has been similar in Europe where the region recorded an operating loss of US$476.9 million (¥43.4 billion), wiping out a profit of US$373.6 million the year before. European sales shrank 23.7 per cent in the quarter to 235,000 units.
Mr Kinoshita said Toyota will try to reduce fixed costs by 10 per cent, mostly by stalling plans to build a Prius factory in Mississippi and set up car plants in China, India and Brazil.
Toyota also will cut spending on marketing and r&d.
Last month, Japan’s Nikkei newspaper reported that Toyota was considering the elimination of 1000 full-time jobs in North America and Britain.
Said Mr Kinoshita: “Outside of Japan, we intend to make every possible effort to protect the jobs of our employees.”
Print it: 
Even though they are closely related there is a difference as Profits are Financial; Assets are physical and Liabilities can be considered to be virtual [as they can be adjusted etc with a bit of creative accounting]- Wheelnut
The net asset situation of a company will reflect its historical profits, ie profits provide working capital and cash reserves, this is what toyota, hyundai and most of the germans have. Historical profits therefore create cash reserves which allow organizations to run operations, and plan for the future without having to borrow 100% to do the same.
Profits are their primary source of funds, in GM’s case however, borrowings are their primary source of funds, oops, my bad, in GM’s case, borrowings are their only source of funds.
GM and chrysler have a negative net asset position, as they have not made profits, they have no cash reserves and have to fund these very losses by way of debt, ie, borrowing.
Stay with me on this, GM will need about 40 billion dollars in governement loans between dec 08 and June 09 because it is broke and making losses, these loans are simply providing working capital to cover operations and debt repayments, ie, GM and Chryler are f#$@3d.
This Gvt assistance is not going to stop, as GM is going to continue making losses, as such GM cannot create cash reserves to continue operations wich is why they are begging for money.
Be scared, Im guessing short term(2-3 years) they are going to need close to 120 billion dollars, and that comes with no guarantee’s of survival.
These are billions people, Chrsler will probably need about
50 billion on top of that. They are both dead, get it.
Quote Axe: see you ignored my reply to this comment, Holden has not made a profit in 3 or 4 years, the G8 has failed in the USA and rwd is dying, please do explain how Holden has helped GM,
They helped GM in the research and development of a number of cars; one of whihc being the New Camaro of which their is a waiting list of 10;000+ people – then there’s the Holden Engine Company which builds engines for a number of car companies all of which helps reduce GMs losses and gradually work their way back to $0+
pffffffffttttttttt GM and Chrysler is old news so back on topic AXE how much do you think Toyota will be the kitty this time next year ?
Wheelnut Says:
February 8th, 2009 at 11:04 am
In 2006 a company records a $45bn Loss – that is a Negative
In 2007 they record a $6bn profit – which is a Positive
Therefore even though the overall result is a Negative of
[-$45bn + $6bn =] -$39bn. In 2007 they actually made an improvement didn’t they… I mean even you would be able to see that.. I made it as simple as i could for you.
Thanks for making it simple, how did they fund that 45 billion dollar loss wheelnut? Debt, they pay interest on the debt and have to make monthly capital repayments to reduce the debt, things are just going from bad to worse as their cashflow requirements due to funding losses is increasing. Here’s the thing tho, they are still making losses, so they need to borrow more..and when they need to borrow more..they inflate the value of their assets..get it.
BM, I can guarantee you that Toyota will take assistance from the Jap Gvt, they have to, we have a trade war about to happen. GM takes prob a 100 billion is USA aid, you think the Jap Gvt is going to leave Toyota out their on there own. Nope. Its gonna get messy.
Best thing to do is kill GM/Chrysler and have a strong Ford, let free enterprise run its course.
“They helped GM in the research and development of a number of cars; one of whihc being the New Camaro of which their is a waiting list of 10;000+ people – then there’s the Holden Engine Company which builds engines for a number of car companies all of which helps reduce GMs losses and gradually work their way back to $0″ wheelnut
I dont care, it does not matter, both holden and GM are losing money, understand.
10000 camaro’s? Listen thats great, but big deal, how about the 15000 g8’s sitting around.
The US market is going to shrink by 5 million cars this year, get it, whats 10000 camaro’s..
BM, again, Toyota will take Jap assistance, as will the other Jap companies, they have to, GM and chysler situation has killed the free market/trade/
Another Toyota blog, and who has the most posts? Holden Spokesman Wheelnut, with his mistress BM not too far behind!
Wheelnut, it’s hilarious how you fight to the living end, yet I hardly see a peep out of you when anything other than GM/GMH or Toyota or Lexus is concerned!
If you applied yourself with such passion in the real world who knows, maybe you might get somewhere in life.
Bavarian Missile (.)(.) Says:
February 8th, 2009 at 11:23 am
“pffffffffttttttttt GM and Chrysler is old news so back on topic AXE how much do you think Toyota will be the kitty this time next year ?”
What do you drive?
Like it or not Axe the US Govt will continue to fund GM Chrysler.. The Australian Govt will continue to fund Holden Ford and Toyo-Oz.. and the Japanese Govt will continue to fund Toyo-kyo because they know its better to spend the money in order to keep 1000s of workers in a job and keep the economy running if not idling; than it is to have 1000s of people out of work and having to pay them even more in weekly social security payments.
“incase you haven’t noticed this topic is about the Toyota company and their financial problems not GM – so you please try to stay on topic as required by the CA Code of Conduct”
In case you hav’nt noticed this is bout the future of our car industy, free enterprise and government intervention, not to mention a trade war, have you reorted me yet, do I now get banned as you can’t sustain an economic arguement?
“I mean there’s nothing to say they had to spend all the money on servicing debt is there? ” wheelnut
IF THEY DON’T SUSTAIN THEIR DEBT, their financiers will foreclose, if they don\t py their wages, their employees will not front up, if they don’t pay their suppliers they will withold delivery…get it..THEY ARE LOCKED IN!
Realist once again all you seem to do is stalk me,Ive reported you again.Mate if you have nothing to comment regarding the thread then dont bother !
What do I drive ? What the hell has that got to do with anything! Not GM or Chrysler thats for sure.
“because they know its better to spend the money in order to keep 1000s of workers in a job and keep the economy running if not idling; than it is to have 1000s of people out of work and having to pay them even more in weekly social security payments.”
Here we are, jobs and social security payments, the last arguement availiable.
Its not an economic arguement, and what will happen will happen(read 380). In Australia 10 – 15 years ago there were around 110000 – 120000 people directly employed within this industry, there are now around about 60000 people, does this tell you somthing. Efficiency, technolgy and in the last 3 – 5 years serious decline in consumer demand for OZ built cars, all of them. The numer of people directly employed in this industry within 10 years will be about 30000 maybe. Thats okay tho, it just represents where we will be at.
The big 3 in the USA can only be the big 2 or 1 even. But they will be strong and have substntially more market share and HOPEFULLY be run properly.
Welfare payments/government assistance to the industry, whats the difference, prefer to see the gvt spend more on infrastruture spending and create real jobs than support a lame duck/
axe Says:
February 8th, 2009 at 10:30 am. Glad you appreciate that Hyundai is their biggest threat, its certainly not Detroit anymore.
With Hyundai/ Kia moving forward when the big three are collapsing and Toyota suffering serious losses, it is evident some serious research and strategies were put in place by Hyundai.
californias answer to the reliant robin,
http://english.aljazeera.net/n.....78702.html
Quote [Real ?]: Wheelnut, it’s hilarious how you fight to the living end, yet I hardly see a peep out of you when anything other than GM/GMH or Toyota or Lexus is concerned!
FYI I do make comments on other articles/topics which have nothing to do with GM-Holden or Toyota/Lexus.
Its just that once one of the handful of Toyota fans on this site make a comment the discussion usially ends up turning into an arguement – about Toyota and their supposed superiority; reliability and value for money etc
Mainly because the Toyota fans apparently don’t kno that much about any other cars except Toyota.. and who do the Toyota fans target in an attempt to try and support their case? GM-Holden
Therefore; virtually every blog on this site becomes a Holden vs Toyota sh!tfight – mainly due to the fact that they Toyota fans don’t understand or refuse to accept what other people are saying or when they finally realise that they are losing they resort to personal attacks and insults
The people who run CA have noticed that anything to do with Toyota or GM-Holden gets the most responses which is why a greater number of articles relate to either Holden or Toyota than any other make inorder to get more hits and maintain their position as Australias most Popular Automotive Blog website
Wheelnut said: “Roflmatic – we are talking about Profits and Losses not Assets/Liabilities or Equity.
You are obviously a Toyo-phile as [like most of them] you have tried to change the subject.”
Name calling now?
I’m glad I don’t have to explain simple accounting concepts to you as Axe seems to have already done so. Cheers Axe.
you have to understand you do not judge a company by the first few bad announcements they make. you still need to consider the underlying strategic and infrastructure strength that they have. the fundamentals of toyota is still as strong as any car company can be and once economy picks up you can be sure thier profits will pick up as well. it will take thier closest competitor VW at least 20-30 years to catch up to where toyota is now. i am no fan of toyota, but ‘how to run a business’ wise i think they are top of the game. as effective as the advertisements of kia/hyundai are now, they are still a long long way behind. GM, chrysler and ford are irrelevant because they arent a business. they are a charity case. centrelink. medicare.
by the way, you delay the prius because not many people are going to have the cash to buy the prius yet until the economy picks up.
Quote Dan…..”Bavaria, get it into your head that the world is not going to come crashing for Toyota over one or two recalls ok. You may keep on dreaming as much as you like, but fact of the matter is, this won’t even make a ripple, no matter how many times you quote the heading of this article here. As someone above said, recalls are part of the business. All manufacturers do recalls every now and then. Keep dreaming all you like, but you;re only setting yourself up for a disappointment.”
Seems there is bad news after bad news weekly for your precious Toyota Dan ………….when you forecasting Toyota start knocking on the Japaneses Governments door for money again ?
Must be time for another recall next week what you think ?
“Toyota also will cut spending on marketing and r&d.”
I can only hope and pray that their advertising on TV becomes severely impacted.
Dingo will be howling mad.
Anyone know a good animal therapist ?
Humble Pie is certainly the flavour of the month for Toyota lovers
Andrew M,
Why a Humble Pie?
Ford and GM would still love to lob of their left one, just to be in the same financial position as Toyota!!
Like most things in life, one’s perception of things pretty much lies from what position in life they have achieved. Toyota was always going to go down eventually because as everyone knows when you are at the top, there are only two way’s to go. Either stay there or fall. GM and Ford on the other hand being in their own version of a toilet can only go up. Although with the help of taxpayers I might add, which without their help would have gone the way of the DODO (along with chrysler). Toyota on the other hand would still continue along without any help in the US.
In this economic climate there was zero chance of toyota continuing along at the current pace, so down the profit gurgler they have gone into losses. Something GM and Ford wrote the book on and alien territory for toyota. GM and Ford on the other hand are at the bottom of the pile and have been for a number of years, so there was only one way for them too go and that is up. You could not get any worse than GM, Ford and Chrysler as far as car companies go IMO!
Dear John, I’d suggest you actually look at the kind of protectionism that Toyota has recieved from it’s government over the pas 40 years, and also the deal sweeteners it has recieved from variuos countries and states around the globe before you make comments on the size of the “HANDOUTS” (why do people not read the facts, as these are only aproved as loans that MUST be paid back within a certain time frame and come with the pre-requisite of having a government member on the board) that “2″ of the D3 got…… Oh and don’t forget that the US tats where Toyota (and others) set up shop had to guarantee that the UAW were not able to force themselves inot those factories.
Wheelnut, yes I still own the TRD. It’s not a bad car by any means, especially since I got a ridiculous deal on it. But it screams out to be a RWD/AWD. Traction control has to be turned off for any decent amount of fun, and if it is a wet day you can forget about spirited driving or else the next car you will be in is a hearse. For a day to day driver, it does the job well, no compromising on space or comfort.
I’ve brought it around Nebo a fair bit too. It’s by far the stickiest FWD I’ve ever driven but it simply cannot compare with a RWD. Lucky it has good brakes or it would have been my bumper that Alborz would’ve seen on Nebo!
I am going to trade it in for an Evo X next year. I only buy cars when I can afford to pay cash.