Comments on: US car industry to fight Obama’s green proposal

By: Frontman

Frontman — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 07:28:11 +0000

Melbournedee, thank you for taking the time to do the sums, that’s actually what I’ve been sidding with the Manufacturers about, we’ve had to be looking at ways to get that average across the fleet whilst the buyers are still stuck in this “It’s my goddamned right to bear arms and I need a Pickup so-as I can carry me shotguns across tha back window”.
When you look at the cars available to them as quite normal vehicles with Hybrid drive units (Prius, Camry Highlander, Escape & now Fusion) there is no real reason for the manufacturers to feel guilty, the public should be held accountable as well for not buying these things.
Supercujo, the best selling vehicle for 25 of the last 27 years in the states has been the F series! The manufacutrers do build what the public want.
Slugger, sorry but Toyota, Nissan, Mercedes, BMW and Hyundai are not yet under the limits set by CAFE Laws. In actual fact Toyota and Ford are very closely leveled when comparing their fleet results.

By: lazybones

lazybones — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 05:46:15 +0000

“target equates to 6.7l/100km”, well spotted Melbournedee. I was reading the wrong column in my spreadsheet!!

But that should be doable in 11 years. The europeans will manage it, why can’t the yanks?

They need to start the message now that downsizing is the only way. Not to mention they need to embrace Diesel.

By: slugger

slugger — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 05:22:43 +0000

Switch the F150s to diesel or diesel hybrid/stop-start whatever. It’s not hard.

Simple case of we want your money but not your rules.

Someone mentioned it’s not just the Big 3 who makes cars in the US, but most of them who aren’t Big 3 have a fleet average of under 30mpg because they don’t have hulking great steel bridges disguised as cars.

By: melbournedee

melbournedee — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 04:13:07 +0000

The 35mpg target won’t be achieved. Lazybones – by my calc 35 miles per imperial gallon is about 8.1l/100km but a US gallon is 20% less so the target equates to 6.7l/100km, which won’t be achieved by the Big 3 in 12 years.

I think they do have a point about letting each state setting their own targets rather than one federal objective. Imagine if in Australia Queensland could mandate side curtain airbags in new cars, Victoria required ESP, NSW mandated Xenon headlights etc, the cost would increase for everybody. If the US states can legislate different fuel economy and emission levels, manufacturers would have to meet the most stringent standard in order to sell a standard product range throughout the country.

By: SuperCujo

SuperCujo — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 01:11:01 +0000

If the US carmakers had of been working towards more efficient engines years ago, they wouldn’t be in this bind now. Bad management…

By: lazybones

lazybones — Thu, 29 Jan 2009 22:31:00 +0000

Simon, very true it will take time. I was watching an article on Fox news where they were talking about downsizing. The presenter said the Toyota Rav 4 was a good SMALL SUV that your kids to start in!! The new Rav 4 is as big as a territory. It gives you some idea of how far they’ve got to go.

As for fear of death, even once they downsize they will still be Americans and have guns

Bav, whats with the (.)(.)?? is that you just flashing your boobies or what?

By: Frontman

Frontman — Thu, 29 Jan 2009 22:25:10 +0000

Ha.ha upshift… You mnis read me I wasn’t calling you a pidgeon hole. I was actually refering to your actions. Same was as we say all Volvo drivers wear hats and Falcodore drivers are Bogans… That kind of pidgeon hole..
I’m no keyboard hero, I’m simply trying to point out that all the manufacturers over there are against these moves.
Sorry if I caused you any stress but I wasn’t name calling (c’mon I’d do better than that if I wanted to insult :p)

By: upshift

upshift — Thu, 29 Jan 2009 14:03:03 +0000

Frontman Says:
January 29th, 2009 at 1:42 pm – Upshift again you pidgeon hole, But it’s ALL the MANUFACTURERS complaining!! There are more than three in the states you know.

“pidgeon hole”? WTF kind of cowardly statement is that?, I wish i could be a keyboard hero like yourself – Then you about face & write, “Actually J&H whilst the D3 do have a lot to lose”.

rack and pinion Says:
January 29th, 2009 at 2:45 pm
Upshift…….its actually the “TWO” big beggars, not three.
Yes thanks for the correction R&P, makes for interesting future outcomes.

By: SamR

SamR — Thu, 29 Jan 2009 09:49:45 +0000

I have a solution for Ford.

For every F150 and retro V8 they sell they also sell a mini car with a 250CC 4 stroke engine that gets 200MPG for $200.
Just raise the price of the F150 to pay for it.

You average them out, problem solved.

By: Frontman

Frontman — Thu, 29 Jan 2009 08:10:50 +0000

Actually J&H whilst the D3 do have a lot to lose, here’s a couple of interesting facts,
1/ Toyota have more SUV’s and Pickups than Passenger vehicles on their American menu. They have outlayed millions reverse engineering F150′s to come up with Tundra and haven’t had near enough time to reclaim some of that investment. Seing as Ford owes F series more than it owes Ford (something about gooses and golden eggs etc) it would worry Toyota to have to lose the Pick-ups, or even spend large on re-developing them.
2/ Ford have already put in place measures for the American public to be greener. Fusion Hybrids are the most economical in class, Escape is also proving to economical. F series are available with Petrol Diesel and Flex Fuel (ULP & 85%E) so these measures are already happening without any further government pressure. GM are also following with the fuel ranges and Hybrid adaptations of their fleet. Actually these two have probably been more active in the pursuit of alternatives than those manufacturers who have a green reputation. (no they aren’t angels and I don’t think either have to get out of bed everymorning for the sun to come up ) Fords Hydrogen Edge currently doing the rounds of Europe is getting as high acclaims as the current fleet of H2 powered BMW 7′s being showcased everywhere.

Sorry for the long post but these are the reasons why i think this idea is a bit left of field and not properly thought through.
Cheers.