Infiniti, Nissan: V8 engines on the way out | CarAdvice

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Infiniti, Nissan: V8 engines on the way out

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By James Stanford |
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It might be about to enter V8 Supercars in Australia, but a key Nissan official has admitted the V8 engine is on the way out.

Nissan executive vice president Andy Palmer has told CarAdvice the current V8 engines that serve in the Nissan and Infiniti products are almost certain to be the last.

He blamed government regulations such as the US CAFE fuel economy standards limiting the amount of V8s it could sell.

“CAFE regulations and CO2 regulations around the world make a V8 [and] the development of a new family of engines almost impossible,” Palmer said.

Infiniti president Johan de Nysschen went one step further and said Nissan’s luxury arm will not introduce any new models with V8 engines.

“I don’t think any car that is on the Infiniti drawing board from here on we should expect to include a V8,” he said.

He indicated that although some markets would still like V8s, the business case doesn’t stack up.

“You cannot develop a V8 engine family that you are going to sell in such low volume, so the choice is easy,” he said.

That leaves the existing FX SUV, the Patrol-based QX and the large M sedan as the last Infiniti models to feature V8 engines.

Infiniti last week introduced the FX and M in Australia. A V8 version of the FX is available locally, but Infiniti Australia has opted for a V6 hybrid M rather than the V8 version.

Nysschen said V8s have no long-term future and that smaller engines will replace them.

“The future, unquestionably, is going to see downsizing of engines, much lower emissions, and fuel consumption and horsepower figures are going to come down,” he said.

Nysschen had a sobering thought for high performance car fans.

“The 600hp [circa-450kW] engines that we see today, which are the top performance cars right now, those will become extinct,” he said.

“The performance is going to be yielded dynamically by downsizing on the one side, power down, but keeping the ratio right by keeping the weight down.”

Asked whether some customers would miss the unmistakable burble of a V8 engine, Nysschen said: “That is not something that is unique for us, that is the same for everybody.”

While the US and its pick-up truck market has traditionally provided a haven for V8 engines, Nysschen said it now provided an example of why they are no longer needed and pointed to Ford introducing a V6 engine in the F-150.

“Those guys offer a V6, a very modern sophisticated V6 and they kind of bet the farm and it has paid off,” Nysschen said.

“The V6 outsells the eight cylinder, even with that conservative audience, so I think it [moving away from V8s] will work.”

The FX V8 SUV that has just been introduced here costs $114,900 and sits at the top of the FX range. It features a 5.0-litre V8, which generates 287kW and 500Nm, which results in a fuel consumption average of 13.1L/100km.

Nissan Australia will enter the V8 Supercars series next year.


 

  • F1

    That’s because Nissan’s V8 are rubbish

    Hyundai makes better V8′s.. Hyundai 5.0L Tau V8 makes 320kW & 510Nm

    Which is class leading and has won many awards..

    “The Tau V8 received the award due to the engine’s “velvety power delivery, competitive performance, and attainable price– all of which epitomize the Korean auto maker’s drive for world-class engineering”, as quoted by Forbes.”

    Nissan is going backwards, poor Nissan.. Where as Hyundai is on their way to the top.. And the way to the top means no compromises..

    • Dominique Vøn Hütch

      Yeah but he’s not talking about kw and nm, he’s talking about fuel saving and power to weight ratios.  AMG makes 400+kw and 600+nm from naturally aspirated V8s which is more then old Hyundai can muster up.

      • F1

        Actually the M156 (6.3L V8) originally made 375kW & 630Nm of torque

        It has been upgraded and now makes 391kW & 630Nm

        The Hyundai 5.0L Tau V8 engine is better as it makes more power & torque per litre..

        And it achieves peak power & torque earlier in the rev range..

        Not to mention the Hyundai Tau engine is a very smooth & quiet unit used in the EQUUS..

        In comparison the merc motor isn’t as sophisticate, efficient or smith and quiet..

        Plus the merc motor is DEAD!

        • F1

          auto correct!!!!!

        • Greg

          6.2 L not 6.3. I still don’t know why Merc continues to name those models by the number 63 when they clearly know the engines CC is actually 6.2L.

        • Phil

          Wrong on so many counts as per usual F1.

          This Hyundai engine has not won multiple awards. That single award is the only engine award Hyundai has recieved for this engine. The groupthat gave them the award –  ”wards” also award the Holden Crummer “Ecotec” engine – so that must give them plenty of cred right? In fact the Commodore engine got a higher grade of award.

          The Mercedes engine is 6.2 litres not 6.3 and it produces its peak torque at 4750NM which is EARLIER in the rev range than the 5000rpm Hyundai.

          Also power/torque per litre is not a particular measure of “better” but in anycase 6.2L/630NM is the same torque per litre as 5.0L510NM so there goes you “more torque per litre” claim for the Hyundai.

          EPA lists the Hyundai as 15/23MPG whilst the Merc is listed at 16/24MPG for the E63. So the Hyundai is NOT as efficient as the Merc – you get a extra mile on every gallon from the Merc despite the Merc having a whopping 70KW and 120NM of extra power.

          The Merc motor is not dead, it is still in production.

          • F1

            The 5.0L Tau engine has won an award, I don’t care what you think, but it has won..

            Secondly the EPA rates cars, and the Tau 5.0L V8 is used in the massive EQUUS sedan which has a significant weight to it

            It’s certainly heavier than the C63 AMG and yet yields better MPG..

            The 5.0L Tau wasn’t designed for crazy peak performance, but is designed for adequate performance with the engine meeting extreme NVH and power delivery standards.. Something the primitive C63 engine lacks..

            And so far the 5.0L Tau hasn’t had issues, in comparison with the merc motor, which means the 5.0L Tau is more reliable..

          • Phil

            But you said it had won and I quote: “many awards”. Now your backtracking and saying “an award”?
            Plus if that award is so significant for you, you must loooove the gruff engine in the old Commodores. As I already mentioned, the same mob that liked the Hyundai engine also award the same accolade to the old 3.8L Commodore engine.
            So, in the eyes of “Wards Best Engines”, the 5.0L Tau met similar “extreme NVH and power delivery standards” to Commodore engines. Great huh?

            Yes the EPA rates cars and for the SECOND TIME, the EPA figures for the Hyundai are 15/23MPG whilst the E63 is 15/24MPG…….do you understand how MPG works? MILES PER GALLON. So a higher figure means your getting more miles per gallon of fuel. In this case the E63 is getting more miles per gallon than the Hyundai.

        • Phil

          Wrong on so many counts as per usual F1.

          This Hyundai engine has not won multiple awards. That single award is the only engine award Hyundai has recieved for this engine. The groupthat gave them the award –  ”wards” also award the Holden Crummer “Ecotec” engine – so that must give them plenty of cred right? In fact the Commodore engine got a higher grade of award.

          The Mercedes engine is 6.2 litres not 6.3 and it produces its peak torque at 4750NM which is EARLIER in the rev range than the 5000rpm Hyundai.

          Also power/torque per litre is not a particular measure of “better” but in anycase 6.2L/630NM is the same torque per litre as 5.0L510NM so there goes you “more torque per litre” claim for the Hyundai.

          EPA lists the Hyundai as 15/23MPG whilst the Merc is listed at 16/24MPG for the E63. So the Hyundai is NOT as efficient as the Merc – you get a extra mile on every gallon from the Merc despite the Merc having a whopping 70KW and 120NM of extra power.

          The Merc motor is not dead, it is still in production.

        • Phil

          Wrong on so many counts as per usual F1.

          This Hyundai engine has not won multiple awards. That single award is the only engine award Hyundai has recieved for this engine. The groupthat gave them the award –  ”wards” also award the Holden Crummer “Ecotec” engine – so that must give them plenty of cred right? In fact the Commodore engine got a higher grade of award.

          The Mercedes engine is 6.2 litres not 6.3 and it produces its peak torque at 4750NM which is EARLIER in the rev range than the 5000rpm Hyundai.

          Also power/torque per litre is not a particular measure of “better” but in anycase 6.2L/630NM is the same torque per litre as 5.0L510NM so there goes you “more torque per litre” claim for the Hyundai.

          EPA lists the Hyundai as 15/23MPG whilst the Merc is listed at 16/24MPG for the E63. So the Hyundai is NOT as efficient as the Merc – you get a extra mile on every gallon from the Merc despite the Merc having a whopping 70KW and 120NM of extra power.

          The Merc motor is not dead, it is still in production.

        • Jauffre

          Pfft who wants a quiet V8? Have you heard an AMG Merc? Ear sex right there.

    • Yetiman

      ha,ha,ha…..good one. You must be working for Hyundai. 

      • Phil

        Yes, he seems to swing between jobs at Hyundai and Lexus.

    • Hung Low

      Rubbish? You are deluded! Taking nothing away from the Hyundai V8, its a great engine but to go out and make a big call that the Nissan V8 is rubbish based on Hp/L output is moronic considering Nissans long history with producing some of the worlds best production engines.

      The Nissan VH V8 are highly detuned and are the basis for the VRH range variations of race engines capable of over 650hp at 10500rpm naturally aspirated for the 3500cc version, hardly rubbish fundamentals.

    • Benny of Bendigo

       Nissan have raced V8′s in Japan in JGTC – GT500 class (resticted to 500hp = 380kw) for a number of years in Skylines, Z’s & GTR’s. That’s right, restricted to 380kw, makes your Hyundai sound a little underpowered! There is already suggestions that KBR will have to effectively restrict the power and its’ delivery on the VK56DE to keep the competition a little even. LOL!

  • http://www.facebook.com/alexander.sambuco Alexander Sambuco

    If they are borrowing engines from Merc for the new Infiniti G, wont they be able to get their V8′s as well? Why spend the R&D when it has been done very well for you?

  • davie

    I can see a certain pragmatic logic in the comments from Nissan. They are saying that its all about power to weight. Passenger cars usually are about 1-1.5 Tons, probably 2Tons max, and light commercials/4wd’s are probably 1.5-2 tons with some big boys (Patrol) about 2.5t +?

    assuming that those average weights can be reduced by a realistic 5-10% and modern technology continues to improve power of 4 and 6 cylinders as it recently has, a 5 litre V8 simply has too many cylinders and too much capacity for a mass produced  “standard car of standard weight” which has been tuned for fuel economy as its major priority – for eg:  new Impreza, CX5,

    Performance models of standard cars will probably continue the trend of turbo versions of normal 4 and 6 cyl engines.

    V8′s will live on. but probably more in exotics.

    Sadly, I think the days of v8 sounds like the iconic 351 Cleveland V8 roar are already long gone.

    • Greg

      True but if you have ever heard a 6.2L AMG V8 in the C63 they sound awesome. Probably the closest sounding thing to those old school muscle cars. I still think a screaming V10 engine is the sweetest sound thing ever. Also those old Audi 5 cylinder Group B rally cars sounding menacing.

  • Dave S

    Nissan makes a point about the F truck using a V6, but Ford (US) would never delete the V8 altogether. the V6 is great for an entry level model, but not for the top of the range model.

  • IfItAintARotorItAintAMotor

    Not sure why lower power and lower weight would be sobering to enthusiasts.  Maybe to those who use their engines as measuring devices.

    Frankly I’m excited for a return to low-powered, low weight cars in the future!

    • Noddy of Toyland

      I think the bloke misjudged the buying public. They will eventually go for smaller engines but only if it means the same or more power. They don’t want to regress, even if the car is lighter.

  • Bigjim

    Its a sad day indeed, nissan have quite a robust v8 (vk 5.6), they should have dropped it in the 370z. More high strung rice burners to come

  • AndyGF

    I love it how all the Japanese brands got suck-ered into the whole GFC and global warming. Then 5 years later they all get ‘caught out’ when their antiquated technology meets the german power house V8′s, all making stonking power with economy to rival a big-four or small V6.

    Now listen to them whine…

    • Hung Low

      The Japanese cars dont exactly rival the German powerhouse engines for price either! When they do, they have engines like the Lexus V10 or GTR VQ35. Hardly antiquated technology as you put it.
      If anything it is the combination of DI and Turbocharging that has become mainstream on German engines giving them the efficiency advantage, but for A-B cars, reliability, cost of repair and durability is still high on the Japanese agenda for their high volume models. 

      • F1

        Funny you say that because you’re actually not comparing Apples with Apples, it’s quite foolish for you and your boyfriend AndyGF to compare a Naturally Aspirated Engine to an Artificially Aspirated Engine 

        In which case, when you have an even playing ground the Japanese dominate and simply do it better than Germany.. 

        • Phil

          How is it foolish when cars from the same segment are competiting against each other? People don’t decide “Oh I’m buying a turbo car” or “I must have a NA powered car”. They decide on the general type of car – eg largeluxury, then look and things like power/economy.

          Of course your contradicting yourself as usual by saying the Japanese dominate, yet just earlier you were banging on about Nissan’s engines being “rubbish”. Failing a contradiction - perhaps you are unaware that Nissan is Japanese?

          • F1

            But most people have no idea or knowledge about these things, and you must be one of them? Right?

            Anyone with the slightest knowledge of the subject would not compare a Naturally Aspirated to a forced induction.. It’s totally stupid..

            An even playing field would be apples and apples with a 0.2L displacement difference max ..

        • Hung Low

          Its obvious that you are nothing but a deluded fanboy F1. The argument has nothing to do with aspiration but more or so the prowess of the big German V8′s at a price over the Jap engines. Stick to driving around in your Hyundai S-coupe with spinner wheel covers you banana.

          • F1

            You must be one of those people who think anything made in Germany automatically is God’s greatest gift..

            Hey it’s made in Germany, so it’s good!!

  • Mick

    I just hope clever engineering can save the V8.
    Ultra compact (narrow angle) and lightweight, with a much lower capacity (3 litres with FI).
    Please someone build it!

    • Robin_Graves

      I’m not a fan of the narrow angle Vee motors, I think a V6 should be 60 degree and a V8 90 degree.  That way the crank can share journals between banks and keep the even-firing cylinder phasing.   As for the death of the V8, we’ve been through this before in the 70′s & ’80s  Technology will improve in the future.  One benefit of V8′s is that they can rev high (short crank) AND have some power overlap which creates smooth torque without a massive flywheel.

      • F1

        V6′s also have power overlap.. Which creates seamless and smooth power delivery..

        V8′s are pretty compact for their size anyway, look at GM 6L+ and their physical dimensions are very small for their displacement..

        • Robin_Graves

          V6 only has 60 degrees of overlap so when cylinder 1 is at 120 Deg cyl 5 is still at TDC, neither of them at a place near effective torque delivery. The exhaust valve opens BBDC as well so it doesnt leave much overlap to be effective.

  • JamesB

    Nissan (and Infiniti) have a very limited customer base for their V8s. Most people would shop for other brands if they want this configuration. It would be a shame to see these engines die before those Chevy pushrods.

  • Kyle

    Don’t see why they are still entering the V8 supercars with this descision…seems ironic as one of the main points of the series was originally to promote the manufacturer’s road cars (V8s) anyway, as ford and holden have been doing for the last 50 odd years or so. Nissan will definitely be taken back on their word about this by supercars fans, heed my warning.

  • Marvine McConoughey

    I appreciate good engineering in any design–two, three, four, five, six, seven, or more.  Oh, yes, who has a seven cylinder engine?  Not sure, but it might be the JCB engine family, not used in cars.