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	<title>Comments on: Holden made Chevrolet Orlando Paris debut</title>
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		<title>By: liam</title>
		<link>http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-307203</link>
		<dc:creator>liam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Sep 2011 01:20:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-307203</guid>
		<description>i think this car will be the next big thing in australia!! it looks good and has a few things that remind me of the cuze (the head lights) and the wheels are like a trade mark for holden!! cant wait for this car to come out... :) (so much better then the new ford territory, much better)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i think this car will be the next big thing in australia!! it looks good and has a few things that remind me of the cuze (the head lights) and the wheels are like a trade mark for holden!! cant wait for this car to come out&#8230; <img src='http://www.caradvice.com.au/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  (so much better then the new ford territory, much better)</p>
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		<title>By: Wheelnut</title>
		<link>http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-96178</link>
		<dc:creator>Wheelnut</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2008 10:18:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-96178</guid>
		<description>Frontman - The Torana is expected to use a NEW lighter more compact more High-Tech Direct Injection V6 Engine and NOT the Alloytec V6 which is used in the VE Commodores..
The New Direct Injection V6 will also have a Twin Turbo Otpimised option - DITTO
Its also more likely that the &quot;Torana&quot; will be built in FWD and AWD as it will be built [here] not only for Local but Export matkets using the same platform as the Insignia

BTW a Coupe is also very likely... cabriolet not so</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Frontman &#8211; The Torana is expected to use a NEW lighter more compact more High-Tech Direct Injection V6 Engine and NOT the Alloytec V6 which is used in the VE Commodores..<br />
The New Direct Injection V6 will also have a Twin Turbo Otpimised option &#8211; DITTO<br />
Its also more likely that the &#8220;Torana&#8221; will be built in FWD and AWD as it will be built [here] not only for Local but Export matkets using the same platform as the Insignia</p>
<p>BTW a Coupe is also very likely&#8230; cabriolet not so</p>
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		<title>By: Frontman</title>
		<link>http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-96056</link>
		<dc:creator>Frontman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Oct 2008 05:12:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-96056</guid>
		<description>J &amp; H,
Hey Doc, the comment on LWB moving offshore has been floating around for near on 12 months. Seems to have stemmed from &quot;evaluations&quot; being done by GM in China in regards to building WM over there for the Asian market. Whilst Aust has enjoyed a strong dollar it has also been bandied about that all LWB production goes there. Also bouyed on by the downturn in domestic sales. But please read that it is &quot;Speculation&quot; at present. 
Same as the stories surrounding &quot;Torana&quot;. Don&#039;t forget that one of the main reasons for Torana show cars developement was to test the water on VE&#039;s Front shape and basic looks. If Torana was to make into production, it would have to come under CAFE laws and EEC5. This would require better fuel consumption than what we are seeing from Alloytec at present. The apparent easy way (and what killed off the ZETA platform) is to make the vehicle lighter. Unfortunaltely for mass market, lighter means FWD. So &quot;Torana&quot; would at least be FWD, at best the AWD. Given the general thinking at GM corporate at present, I can see them having 2 heavy RWD platforms when the are struggling to retain 1.
GM are not alone however as this is the same dillema faced by Ford Australia, although their future platform is easily converted to AWD and is lighter thatn ZETA. Yet even it is not in the clear, with evaluations and speculation running rampant. 
Wheelnut, Mullaly isn&#039;t that bad so far, at least he is acting on the decisions being need to be made and is forcing the change to happen in the US. It will be interesting to see if the new man here can still be as strong as he has been previuosly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>J &amp; H,<br />
Hey Doc, the comment on LWB moving offshore has been floating around for near on 12 months. Seems to have stemmed from &#8220;evaluations&#8221; being done by GM in China in regards to building WM over there for the Asian market. Whilst Aust has enjoyed a strong dollar it has also been bandied about that all LWB production goes there. Also bouyed on by the downturn in domestic sales. But please read that it is &#8220;Speculation&#8221; at present.<br />
Same as the stories surrounding &#8220;Torana&#8221;. Don&#8217;t forget that one of the main reasons for Torana show cars developement was to test the water on VE&#8217;s Front shape and basic looks. If Torana was to make into production, it would have to come under CAFE laws and EEC5. This would require better fuel consumption than what we are seeing from Alloytec at present. The apparent easy way (and what killed off the ZETA platform) is to make the vehicle lighter. Unfortunaltely for mass market, lighter means FWD. So &#8220;Torana&#8221; would at least be FWD, at best the AWD. Given the general thinking at GM corporate at present, I can see them having 2 heavy RWD platforms when the are struggling to retain 1.<br />
GM are not alone however as this is the same dillema faced by Ford Australia, although their future platform is easily converted to AWD and is lighter thatn ZETA. Yet even it is not in the clear, with evaluations and speculation running rampant.<br />
Wheelnut, Mullaly isn&#8217;t that bad so far, at least he is acting on the decisions being need to be made and is forcing the change to happen in the US. It will be interesting to see if the new man here can still be as strong as he has been previuosly.</p>
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		<title>By: Wheelnut</title>
		<link>http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-95964</link>
		<dc:creator>Wheelnut</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Oct 2008 01:56:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-95964</guid>
		<description>I think they gotta get rid of Wagonner and let Lutzy take over as he was the one who helped get Chrysler out of the s--t a back in the 90&#039;s.. 

The thing is compared to Lutz Waggoner isn&#039;t what you would call a car enthusiast - he is an &quot;academic&quot; who graduated from business college with several degrees etc but doesn&#039;t have any real passion or interest in the industry. He thinks that everyone else thinks the same way as he does and wants what he wants

&quot;I drive a big SUV [which is paid for by the company] therefore the rest of America wants big SUVs too&quot;

Whereas Lutzy has spent virtually his whole life around cars and the automotive industry.. he is passionate about everything he does and keeps in touch with whats going on with other car companies. 

Lutz realises that there are other GM companies that are better at building RWD FWD and AWD cars than they do in the USA and therefore decided to take advantage of their international resources and import cars from Australia and Europe - whereas Waggoner tends to think no-one can ddo it better than us Americans.

So really the best solution for GM is to get riod of P-Rick Waggoner.
In the same way Ford have to get rid of either Ford Jr Snr Jr or Mullaly</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think they gotta get rid of Wagonner and let Lutzy take over as he was the one who helped get Chrysler out of the s&#8211;t a back in the 90&#8242;s.. </p>
<p>The thing is compared to Lutz Waggoner isn&#8217;t what you would call a car enthusiast &#8211; he is an &#8220;academic&#8221; who graduated from business college with several degrees etc but doesn&#8217;t have any real passion or interest in the industry. He thinks that everyone else thinks the same way as he does and wants what he wants</p>
<p>&#8220;I drive a big SUV [which is paid for by the company] therefore the rest of America wants big SUVs too&#8221;</p>
<p>Whereas Lutzy has spent virtually his whole life around cars and the automotive industry.. he is passionate about everything he does and keeps in touch with whats going on with other car companies. </p>
<p>Lutz realises that there are other GM companies that are better at building RWD FWD and AWD cars than they do in the USA and therefore decided to take advantage of their international resources and import cars from Australia and Europe &#8211; whereas Waggoner tends to think no-one can ddo it better than us Americans.</p>
<p>So really the best solution for GM is to get riod of P-Rick Waggoner.<br />
In the same way Ford have to get rid of either Ford Jr Snr Jr or Mullaly</p>
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		<title>By: Wheelnut</title>
		<link>http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-95961</link>
		<dc:creator>Wheelnut</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Oct 2008 01:46:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-95961</guid>
		<description>Bankruptcy is an option for GM but its not the only option.

Given that the USA is in the middle of a recession; GM could sack half [if not all] of its factory workers and close half [if not all] of its factories 

Because most of the US factories are operating at less than 70% whereas Holden for example are currently at 90% with plans to expand.... and pull out of the USA. 

They oculd make RWD cars including in Canada; FWD cars in Europe with Australia making up any shortfall.

Bob Lutz illuded to the possibiility of this happening but P-rick Waggoner has denied it on several occassions which impliess that he too is thinking about it. 

Inorder to be successful in business you should focus on your strengths.. and compared to the quality of GM cars form Canada Europe and Oz the American cars are the weakest link - a fact which the American motorists themselves are starting to realise as they are buying more and more imported compact cars.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bankruptcy is an option for GM but its not the only option.</p>
<p>Given that the USA is in the middle of a recession; GM could sack half [if not all] of its factory workers and close half [if not all] of its factories </p>
<p>Because most of the US factories are operating at less than 70% whereas Holden for example are currently at 90% with plans to expand&#8230;. and pull out of the USA. </p>
<p>They oculd make RWD cars including in Canada; FWD cars in Europe with Australia making up any shortfall.</p>
<p>Bob Lutz illuded to the possibiility of this happening but P-rick Waggoner has denied it on several occassions which impliess that he too is thinking about it. </p>
<p>Inorder to be successful in business you should focus on your strengths.. and compared to the quality of GM cars form Canada Europe and Oz the American cars are the weakest link &#8211; a fact which the American motorists themselves are starting to realise as they are buying more and more imported compact cars.</p>
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		<title>By: The Salesman</title>
		<link>http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-95945</link>
		<dc:creator>The Salesman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Oct 2008 21:54:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-95945</guid>
		<description>Wheelnut,

Interesting read, i guess we will have to see what happens.
Have you read GM death watch?
Google it and come back to me</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wheelnut,</p>
<p>Interesting read, i guess we will have to see what happens.<br />
Have you read GM death watch?<br />
Google it and come back to me</p>
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		<title>By: Wheelnut</title>
		<link>http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-95912</link>
		<dc:creator>Wheelnut</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Oct 2008 10:03:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-95912</guid>
		<description>The V6 [6 cylinder] market isn&#039;t shrinking... if anything its the V8 market that&#039;s shrinking quicker - even though 
1 in 3 commodores sold is a V8 

I mean the Turbo charged FPV Typhoon produces just 7Kw less than its bigger V8 brothers.... and the DITTO V6 that will be in the &quot;Torana&quot; is likely to produce around 300Kw - and that&#039;s before HSV get their hands on it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The V6 [6 cylinder] market isn&#8217;t shrinking&#8230; if anything its the V8 market that&#8217;s shrinking quicker &#8211; even though<br />
1 in 3 commodores sold is a V8 </p>
<p>I mean the Turbo charged FPV Typhoon produces just 7Kw less than its bigger V8 brothers&#8230;. and the DITTO V6 that will be in the &#8220;Torana&#8221; is likely to produce around 300Kw &#8211; and that&#8217;s before HSV get their hands on it.</p>
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		<title>By: Wheelnut</title>
		<link>http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-95906</link>
		<dc:creator>Wheelnut</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Oct 2008 09:25:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-95906</guid>
		<description>Quote [The Salesman]:GM is in a desperate situation, the V6 market has dried up quicker than the Murray River.

Could it be that the only reason you say that Dingo is because despite its supposed F1 inspired engine.. in terms of popularity and sales the Aurion - particularly the TRD version has become a bigger Lemon than a Leyland P76? 

As today I saw a TRD Aurion which was reduced by almost $25k.

The Torana is more of a certainty than a small car because why would Holden bother making a small front wheel drive car like a Barina when its cheaper and easier not to mention more cost effective to import it from Opel who have more experience with FWD than Holden - you focus on your strengths.

I mean one of the reasons GM ended up in the trouble they are in is because they had 2 factories less than 1000Kms apart both operating at less than 70% capacity and both building exactly the same cars

Which is why its more likely that Holden will build the RWD Torana [which will also become the new Pontiac G6 sedan]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Quote [The Salesman]:GM is in a desperate situation, the V6 market has dried up quicker than the Murray River.</p>
<p>Could it be that the only reason you say that Dingo is because despite its supposed F1 inspired engine.. in terms of popularity and sales the Aurion &#8211; particularly the TRD version has become a bigger Lemon than a Leyland P76? </p>
<p>As today I saw a TRD Aurion which was reduced by almost $25k.</p>
<p>The Torana is more of a certainty than a small car because why would Holden bother making a small front wheel drive car like a Barina when its cheaper and easier not to mention more cost effective to import it from Opel who have more experience with FWD than Holden &#8211; you focus on your strengths.</p>
<p>I mean one of the reasons GM ended up in the trouble they are in is because they had 2 factories less than 1000Kms apart both operating at less than 70% capacity and both building exactly the same cars</p>
<p>Which is why its more likely that Holden will build the RWD Torana [which will also become the new Pontiac G6 sedan]</p>
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		<title>By: The Salesman</title>
		<link>http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-95863</link>
		<dc:creator>The Salesman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Oct 2008 03:13:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-95863</guid>
		<description>JEYKL &amp; HYDE,

Agila, right?

Wheelnut,

GM is in a desperate situation, the V6 market has dried up quicker than the Murry River.
They have to build a small car because that is where the market is going. 
The Torana I doubt.
Re introduce the very successful crewman Ute?. You know what they say. Desperate times call for desperate measures.....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JEYKL &amp; HYDE,</p>
<p>Agila, right?</p>
<p>Wheelnut,</p>
<p>GM is in a desperate situation, the V6 market has dried up quicker than the Murry River.<br />
They have to build a small car because that is where the market is going.<br />
The Torana I doubt.<br />
Re introduce the very successful crewman Ute?. You know what they say. Desperate times call for desperate measures&#8230;..</p>
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		<title>By: DanMan</title>
		<link>http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-95860</link>
		<dc:creator>DanMan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Oct 2008 02:40:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caradvice.com.au/17169/holdens-role-in-chevrolet-orlando-paris-debut/#comment-95860</guid>
		<description>Toyota Camry (4 cyl) 2,114 36.4%
Toyota Aurion 1,240 13.1%

Add those % together. Camry and Aurion where split into different markets..

Holden Commodore 4,462 47.2%

So add cam/aurion together (for the sake of argument) and their maket share is greater than commodore. Maybe not outright volume but in penetration.

all figures from POLK Sept 2008. 
Does that answer your statement John?

Anyway this vehicle above looks like a blend of every design cue shown at a motorshow in the last year..

Lexus exhausts? WTF.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Toyota Camry (4 cyl) 2,114 36.4%<br />
Toyota Aurion 1,240 13.1%</p>
<p>Add those % together. Camry and Aurion where split into different markets..</p>
<p>Holden Commodore 4,462 47.2%</p>
<p>So add cam/aurion together (for the sake of argument) and their maket share is greater than commodore. Maybe not outright volume but in penetration.</p>
<p>all figures from POLK Sept 2008.<br />
Does that answer your statement John?</p>
<p>Anyway this vehicle above looks like a blend of every design cue shown at a motorshow in the last year..</p>
<p>Lexus exhausts? WTF.</p>
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