The GS450h itself is a perfect balance of size, comfort, quality, style, economy and of course an infallible track record for reliability. At $130000, it is a bargain.

There is no problem at the low end of the market & I would suggest that at the top end it will have about the same depreciation as other vehicle in its price range & will be cheaper to run than those equivalent vehicles.

I’m sure Holden and Ford employ that thinking mate… Toyotas run solid, my first Corolla lasted me 300,000kms (I bought it on 195,000) and never let me down, now sure it was just a Corolla (you’re think so big deal).. well my current (privately imported) 20Valve Corolla which is 14 years old, delivers 7-8000revs from a mere 1.6L capacity.. I occasionally have runs with DIE HARD v6 Commofalcodores and they like to ask what engine am I actually running.

Off topic I know, but whats your bloddy problem in not being able to admit and give due credit to the engineering magnificance of Toyota or Lexus?

Let’s have a run :) anytime , anywhere . I’d like to see the look on your face when all you see is a Toyota badge that goes past you :)

Jeremy Clarkson admitted on ep.1 of season 9 that he actually loved the Gs450H.

While you go on about BMW and their hydrogen prototype, Toyota and Lexus did their research ages ago which is evident in their models as you can see.. Go check some of the U.S based sites and the array of hybrid vehicles is pretty extensive.

I’m sure you know of the upcoming hybrid Supra? 0-60mph in less than 5 seconds, top speed of 175mph and still return 30mpg? oh well you just learnt something now didn’t you? that engine is derived from a Lexus with tweaks.

From what I can read of all your posts, it seems to be of quite difficu N ce for you to admit that Toyota or Lexus (for that matter) are actually leaving their competitors far behind.

“I don’t think that any manufacturer is too concerned at what their product is like when the warranty period is over. They don’t build them to last forever.”

I was specific in my reference to Hydrogen powered vehicles, so specific in fact that I referred to BMW’s Hydrogen technology. Here is a quote from a recent MSNBC article on the new 745h;

“Most carmakers experimenting with hydrogen are doing so with fuel cells that would use the energy carrier to create an electric power system. But BMW’s path is to use liquid hydrogen in existing internal combustion engines since the infrastructure for fuel cells and refueling hydrogen is so limited.”
also
“The space that two fuel tanks take up means only the 7-Series will offer the hydrogen package at first. BMW’s long-term goal is to offer hydrogen motors in all its cars.”
See the full article at http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14798876/

I do not think that electric vehicles or Hybrids are the way of the future. I think we will see plenty of them in the next few years but they will die a slow death in the face of genuine combustion engine fuel alternatives. They are simply a stop-gap that makes the manufacturer look green and the new owner feel environmentally all warm inside.

BMW already have a vehicle with an internal combustion engine that will run on a genuine alternative fuel ie Hydrogen. It’s not hard to envisage in 10 to 20 years Hydrogen outlets at our current petrol stations. It also means that oil companies will continue to make money (they will produce Hydrogen alongside oil based fuel) and Governments will continue to benefit from fuel excise. Do you think that this isn’t being thought about by them now…? Do you really think you will be plugging your car into the power socket at home while oil companies fade into history and Governments go without? …I don’t think they will be letting that happen.

“[Hydrogen cars] have a hydrogen tank, and a fuel cell which adds hydrogen and oxygen to make water vapor as the only ‘emission’ – in order to provide energy for ELECTRIC MOTORS. These ELECTRIC MOTORS are also motor-GENERATORS which put electricity into BATTERIES for later use, when the car is decelerating or stopping – REGENERATIVE BRAKING OF A HYBRID.”

Source: http://www.autobloggreen.com/2.....r-a-prius/

If you have issues with the batteries in a hybrid car then logically you would have the same issues in a hydrogen car. A hydrogen car pretty much is a hybrid car except it uses hydrogen instead of gasoline as fuel. In gasoline cars the energy from the engine is converted to kinetic energy, and during braking is converted to chemical energy or electrical energy. With hydrogen you have electric energy instantly. Hydrogen may be good if there isn’t enough gasoline in the world but the reality is that there isn’t much hydrogen in the world either. But hydrogen can be produced by electrolysis of water to its elements, but this requires electrical energy.

“The Toyota Prius and Honda Civic gas/electric hybrid cars both were both listed among the most reliable vehicles.”

The batteries are warrantied and Toyota has said they should last the life of the car. Of course, the Prius hasn’t been out for that long. Suppose we are to assume anything that is not true and tried is defective. When airbags came out did you wait several years and collect data on airbag efficacy before buying a car with airbags? When ABS came out did you do the same?

Lexus and Toyota vehicles have a strong history of reliability and the hybrid electric models seem to be fine so far. To raise the standard of evidence and continually demand absolute perfection over the tiniest detail even goes against Lexus philosophy, which states that perfection is an unattainable goal but the firm makes gradual and relentless progression towards the goal of perfection and even if they cannot reach perfection the attempt itself is worth it.

See here

Obviously not. All cars depreciate unless they are very unique like some Ferraris.

Furthermore, Lexus has has excellent history with reliability. JD Power and Associate Survey usually puts them first.

Just because a perfectly sterile environment cannot be achieved it doesn’t mean doctors should operate in sewers.

You seem skeptical of hybrids because it is new technology but say “I am leaning towards Hydrogen as the fuel of the future” when there is so much more uncertainty over hydrogen.

Hybrid technology is not an alternative fuel. The Prius uses gasoline. Hybrids can be attached to diesels, biofuels, and in theory even LPG and hydrogen.

I dont know what the Hybrid specific parts will cost to repair or replace but an educated guess tells me that cheap or reasonable or even good value for money will not be the words or phrases used to describe their purchase / replacement.

I guess we will have to come back to this in a about 2012 or so and see what the story is!

Hopefully in the meantime they have developed Hydrogen to the point it is more viable than these Hybrid cars. Seems like a bandaid solution to me, more of a marketing exercise than a real attempt at creating a viable alternative fuel or means of propulsion.

We will just have to wait and see I suppose or ask someone who does own one?!?