Update: Ford Falcon EcoLPi Review

The new 2011 Ford Falcon EcoLPi LPG will produce the same amount of power and torque as the standard petrol-powered I6 engine when the vehicle goes on sale in a few months’ time.

Ford Australia revealed the EcoLPi powertrain will produce 198kW of power at 5000rpm and 409Nm of torque at 3250rpm – figures identical to the petrol-powered I6 engine when operating on 95 RON premium unleaded. On standard 91 RON unleaded the I6 engine produces 195kW and 391Nm.

Performance from the liquid phase injection EcoLPi is a significant step up from the old E-Gas model, which produced 156kW and 371Nm (27 percent increase in power, 10 percent increase in torque).

Ford says preliminary testing of the Falcon EcoLPi sedan has delivered fuel economy and emissions improvements of between 12 and 15 percent.

The previous generation E-Gas models used 14.9 litres/100km and emitted 240g/km CO2. Therefore, if the pre-production tests are on the money, expect the EcoLPi to deliver figures around 12.7-13.1 litres/100km and 204-211g/km.

Economy is worse than the petrol-powered I6, which achieves 9.9 litres/100km, however current fuel prices have LPG around $1.00 per litre cheaper than premium unleaded petrol, leading to a significant reduction in EcoLPi running costs.

EcoLPi technology will be available in Falcon XT, G6, G6E and XR6 sedan models, as well as the XL, R6 and XR6 utes (in both Cab Chassis and Styleside Box bodies).

The introduction of the new LPG system will also see the four-speed automatic transmission of the previous E-Gas models replaced by the ZF six-speed automatic transmission on all EcoLPi models.

Ford has been without an LPG-powered Falcon since September 2010. Earlier this year, Ford Australia’s Sinead McAlary said LPG vehicles usually accounted for 20 to 25 percent of total Falcon sales. Ford expects the reintroduction of LPG will have a positive impact on sales in the second half of this year.

Liquid injection is the most advanced LPG system used today. Traditional LPG systems turn liquefied gas into vapour before feeding it into the engine via a venturi in the throttle body, whereas the liquid phase injection system takes the gas in liquid state all the way to the injectors.

This means the fuel is injected into the intake port with more precision and under more controlled circumstances, leading to improved volumetric efficiency.

As the figures above show, the overall result is increased power, torque and efficiency.

Other technical highlights of the EcoLPi system over the E-Gas include new fuel rail and injectors designed specifically for the engine, lightweight pistons and low-friction rings, 12.0:1 compression ratio, new polymer fuel lines, new fuel line and in-tank filters, new catalytic converter, significant modifications to the fuel tank and recalibration of the engine management system.

Ford Australia President and CEO, Bob Graziano, said EcoPLi technology was a key pillar in Ford’s introduction of more fuel efficient and environmentally conscious vehicles.

“The introduction of EcoLPi is the next step in Ford Australia’s comprehensive new product offensive, which will see close to 85 percent of our vehicle line-up all-new or significantly updated over the next 12 months,” Mr Graziano said.

“LPG is an alternative fuel that is readily available almost anywhere in Australia and provides real benefits for Australian consumers, with reduced fuel costs contributing to a significant improvement in cost of ownership.

“Falcon EcoLPi offers customers the power, torque and overall engine performance they expect from a traditional Aussie six, coupled with all the space, comfort and towing capability of a family sedan, while at the same time delivering the fuel costs of a smaller car.”

Ford Australia will introduce the Ford Territory diesel in the coming weeks, followed by the Ford Mondeo EcoBoost mid-year and the Ford Falcon EcoBoost early in 2012.




  • F1MotoGP

    They need to do something because the average fuel price increase is the highest for LPG.

    • Andy Kerr

      I am getting a new one for work. 2 problems fixed from my old one. More boot space and more power. I can get 12-13 out of mine on a big trip, and this sounds better(reverse sensors too) Bring it on….. I will not put a scratch on it in case I buy it.

  • Doctor

    Good to see that the power/torque figures are matched with the current petrol units. Consumption, albeit more than the petrol version, will result in half the fuel cost. I just hope that the tank packaging is better than in the old E-Gas cars. I can hear the fleet owners lining up already…

  • JEKYL & HYDE

    so thats lpg only then?can’t come soon enought for the renta’s/fleet’s.

  • Car Fanatic

    Wait a minute. Expect between 12.7 and 13.1 per 100 kms. This must be wrong because Andrew M was adamant it would do 10l/100km.

    So that still makes Diesel king.

    • Dave S

      How can you say Diesel is king? When it is neither cheaper or cleaner than LPG.

      Good work, we need to see more LPG powered cars on the road.

    • Road Warrior

      …aaaand the diesel will still cost twice as much to run and still pollute more than the LPi engine. Zing.

      • Ima Hogg

        Diesel near where I live was 1.54. Umm how Does this make diesel King? I don’t really know how much Lpg is at the moment but lets say 1.00 at the worst price possible and you buy 50 litres so the price is 50 bucks but the same amount of diesel costs 77 bucks. Even if diesel lasts longer you are still at the worst caase possible wastin 22 bucks. Think about it Car Fanatic.

    • Tomas79

      But what does the LPG consumption jump to, under some proper load?? From Personal experience, could easily tripple that of the diesel! Also u dont get the rotten cabbage smell with diesel!!

      • Andrew M

        Sure LPG might give a “rotton cabbage smell” as you term it, but its merely an added smell so leaks can be detected.

        The soapy smell coming from diesels which you seem to think is more pleasant is the smell that is deadliest of all fuels.

      • Mrbean303

        no…you just get that foul diesel smell;actually,lpg doesn’t smell at all-the refineries add an odourent so leaks can be detected by smell..

    • Andrew M

      These predicted figus will see it cost bang on what your Diesel Jetta claims using 5.5L/100k.

      Also diesel seems to be more expensive than the what we were costing on with our discussion on the other thread.

      Sure LPG will gain excise of 2.5cpl in December this year, but lately Diesel seems to increase that much each week.

      Im am as you illude to surprised at only getting high 12′s in economy. My power and torque predictions were bang on, and They have thrown another 2 gears at, as well as bringing the technology out of the dark ages.

      But that aside its still going to be cheaper to run, let alone less deadly to inhale

    • Frenchie

      Ford are quoting an urban figure.
      Andrew is quoting a combined figure.

  • m2m

    Why would you buy a petrol model? Providing the difference is imperceptible, you’d be nuts
    To not pick the LPi! (hvent driven either so I don’t know).

  • TMG

    At last, I’m a huge fan of DLPG or ECOLPI as they call it now, just glad they didn’t rush it and send it out to market to quickly and stuff it up (as years past may testify) Lets hope the CO2 fig is below the 200g/km and comb fuel consumption is in the 11′s, that will make a real case for the “Green fleet” followers.

  • Accountant

    have to have a look at it

  • http://Telsa paulb

    Sounds awsome, almost unbelievable the technology quamtam leap this system has taken.

    • Stoney!

      Hardly! It’s just that the current system is pathetically behind the times.

      Stoney!

      • http://Telsa paulb

        It was unfortunate Stoney that Ford has not has LPG available for the last 6 months.But on the other side of things,it been worth the wait

  • http://Audi Robj

    A very good and advanced system. Glad to see Fird has invested and they get lots of sales on it. Hopefully others will follow also.

  • Manual Junkie

    Ford Australia, a wagon version of this please…

    • nickdl

      Or a Territory…

  • Shak

    Now if Only Holden would hurry up and ask HSV for their system to bung into their hum drum Commodore range.

    • http://Telsa paulb

      Shak,Holden have a good LPG system.No doubt the HSV system is better.For long country drives,Holden duel fuel gives great range in km.

  • Peter

    This is excellent, I rekon this will sell well! Similar performance, lower emissions, cost saving…FORD need to market this hard!

  • adam smolkowicz

    wouldn’t mind seeing this when it comes out

  • Vibe

    I hope it sells well, it’s just peoples perception of LPG that lets these cars down. The general view is that it destroys boot space and is for taxis, yet it’s cheap and Australia is one of the largest producers and largest reserves for LPG.

    Servos need to do their bit too, filling up with LPG isn’t pleasant most of the time, out in the weather and with some crummy old pump.

    • Andrew M

      I used to have LPG, and the refuelling procedure was actually more pleasant.

      I never experienced isolated bowsers and I didnt have to stand on one foot and squint my right eye to stop the bak flow clicking off the bowser.

      Ill certainly be looking at LPG again now its caught back up to the injection system tech of unleaded

    • Congeorge

      Government taxes are set to increase for LPG and it does add another layer of technology to already highly complicated vehicles so maintenance costs may rise .

  • Alexander

    Diesel is far from being a great alternative to petrol or LPG cars. Burning diesel is very dirty process that produces far more toxins than Petrol and has Proved to be great problem in congested European cities. To get a diesel within reach of a Petrol cleanliness wise expensive particulate filters are needed, hence why meeting euro6 emissions laws will prove a huge headache for manufacturers. Burning LPG is pretty much as clean as it gets (with the exeption of Natural Gas), LPG has a far lesser impact on air quality than diesel, it’s cheaper to run and litre for litre emits far less C02 than Diesel. I think LPI / electric hybrids are a great idea (like the KIA/Hyundai LPI hybrids) as they would have very little impact on air pollution (I’m pretty sure some Priuses has been converted to run LPG as well)

    • Andrew M

      True,

      On the emissions front LPG emitts something like 90% less particulates and other deadly emissions compared to Diesel.

      These apparently ancient/dinosaur barge of a Commodores even in petrol guise rank better on the green guide compared to a small diesel hatch back

    • Congeorge

      Diesel burns more thougherly than petrol and usually has better fuel economy . LPG being a highly compressed gas does have its dangers .

  • nickdl

    Sounds fantastic as long as they don’t put the spare tyre in the boot again… and still keep a spare tyre unlike the can of goo in the Commodore. Let’s hope that this technology can re-ignite sales in both of the locally-made sixes.

    The government really needs to wake up and realise that LPG could be one of the easiest switches to alternative fuels. The infrastructure is there, there’s no difference in performance over petrol and Australia has enough gas for many, many, many years to come. Why they’re putting a tax on it is beyond me, especially considering the CO2 emissions are similar, if not less than the petrol powered equivalents.

    • Congeorge

      You will miss a spare tyre when you rely need one .Recently had a complete blow out on the Mulgrave free way , tyre was shredded , thank God i had a spare .

  • The Original Tom

    No mention is made here of a comparison on CO2 emissions between the LPI and the standard petrol.

    If you do your research it seems to show that LPI isn’t heaps better than petrol in terms of CO2, making this basically an exercise for people who want to save money on petrol, full stop. Nothing else.

    • Andrew M

      Um, the LPG model is supposed to emitt 204-211 g Co2.

      The petrol version emitts 236g.

      So money is saved, less Co2 is emitted, and thats still not the full stop.
      Most people are all hung up on Co2. Co2 is only a small part of a vehicles emissions to worry about. Co2 is actually the good green house gas, a higher concentration actually increases plant growth to name just one good thing.

      The emissions we should be worried about is all the other stuff like NoX etc.
      As far as the deadly harmfull emissions goes, LPG spanks Fuels like Diesel to death, and thats after slightly higher consumption rates of LPG are factored.

      No I believe that is the full stop.

  • supercujo

    You can’t say that Tom, it goes against the press release from Ford.

    This car is a godsend for the climate change movement…

  • Roger Ramjet

    The CO2 fiasco is a term developed by authorities to tax motor vehicles. In reality in Australia the CO2 output means nothing! In fact the global contribution of CO2 soley from passenger cars is so minimal compared to natural sources of CO2 around the world, one has to wonder!
    The issue with diesels is that they expel toxins. The particulate filters do a great job until they get blocked and cause the engine to go into “burn cycle” which expels all these toxins and particulates back out. Diesels pass emission standards when new and particulate filters are clean but it has to dispose all the crud at least a dozen times a year if not more depending on usage!

  • Frostie

    Now to wait for the Direct Port Fuel Injection (EcoBoost)FPV F6.

    • Andrew M

      Yeah put it on LPG because from what Ive read it works extremely well on boost

  • Car Fanatic

    Diesel vehicles will benefit from the development of ceramic carbon filters which will convert NOX to harmless nitrogen. As for CO2 emissions, we’ve already established the LPG commodore emits 217g/km and the Diesel Passat emits 175g/km.

    By my reckoning that’s 24% more emissions from the LPG unit.

    Go Diesel.

    • Andrew M

      Most people are all hung up on Co2. Co2 is only a small part of a vehicles emissions to worry about. Co2 is actually the good green house gas, a higher concentration actually increases plant growth to name just one good thing.

      I dont know where your emissions figures come from, but LPG emitts something like 90% less particulates and other harmfulls into our atmosphere

      You can have your reckoning, but its wrong.

      If Diesel is in fact as clean as you say, whay is it that a small diesel hatch back ranks lower on the green vehicle guide than a humble Dinosaur / bohemith of a Commodore??

      • http://Telsa paulb

        Diesel NoX emmissions have been reduced by over 70%.The fuel refining will be the next reduction targets.$$.Still need Diesels in suv’s+4wd+heavy machienery

  • Nick K

    If this car has a conformable tank then no packaging issues… If so a landmark achievement! You don’t need a diesel with this system and that includes the Territory. About time we got a properly engineered LPG system.., well done Ford.

  • BOSSCR

    This is great news. Hopefully Ford Aus will claw back some of the fleet sales lost to the Camry.

    For the record Tomas79, I’ll take sitting in traffic behind an LPG car rather than a diesel anyday. Diesel’s have their purpose and i am all for them, but LPG is better all round.

  • Clint W

    Its great that FORD are releasing all these new vehicles, but i think its a little to late, Australia needs them NOW not in 6ths time…..

    • Mark

      wouldn’t mid year mean 2-3 months time?

  • Car Fanatic

    CeramIc carbon filters are coming. Diesel will be cleaner, trust me on this, Nox outputs will be virtually eradicated.

    • Andrew M

      Put up the white flag mister “LPG dooms dayer”

      Give some praise to the massive amount of Aussie reserves (gas) finally being givin some lime light

  • Lapdog

    I would buy this in wagon. I wouldnt even think about it.

  • Fairlane

    About time. Its been a long wait, my old BA E-Gas is due for a replacement and ive been waiting for LPI for 3 years. Big fan of the Ford dedicated gas cars, had an AU2 previous. Just hope they mounted the spare tyre vertically, finally.

    • TMG

      Won’t come with a Spare unless you option it, will have a can of goo instead, believe the boot will be bigger then last of the DLPG’s. don’t believe they can do a vertical spare, as the tank will take a lot of space under the floor. should be fine for cabbie though and should hold a suitcase or three.

  • Car Fanatic

    No white flags here, we’ll just wait for the ceramic carbon filters to be standard on diesel cars before Euro 6 kicks in in 2014.

    • alexander

      And those filters add significantly to the purchasing cost of a Diesel car, while also adding to service costs and are extremely expensive to replace is broken. Not to mention they have negative effects on fuel economy and the engine’s power output. Consider that diesel is a dwindling resource and even if diesel exhaust gasses are heavily filtered, it still wont be totally as clean as petrol or anywhere near as clean as LPG. Is it really worth it when we can create downsized petrols that are similarly efficient and emit less c02, or focus on further developing Hybrids and EVs?

    • Andrew M

      Yes, and by then I would have paid off an LPG vehicle premium twice over.

      What are these new filters going to cost and do you have real emissions figures yet or are you just clinging at fluff??
      I’d want to hope Diesel emissions improve in 3 yrs time, at least you now realise they are unacceptable….
      LPG and unleaded dont need these “ceramic filters” to look good, imagine if they bolted one on an Unleaded or LPG vehicle….

      But one thing you forget is that its not only diesel that is making gains, but LPG and unleaded power plants are also moving into the future.

      Surely you arent silly enough to think the whole world except for diesel is standing still……….

  • Wayne Kerr

    Great release from Ford; although it’s doubtful, I would love to see a turbo version of this LPG :p

  • goodjjp

    Is it LPG gas or liquid injecion?

  • XR

    The best part about this is Australia has access to this resource as well so it has the potential to reduce our reliance on the overseas inflated market. With no power loss and now with the silky smooth ZF transmission the LPG Falcon is a truly competitive package.

    Dear Ford, market this vehicle well for a CHANGE. Holden are doing a great job marketing their rubbish Daewoos. You have a great package, now let the consumers know how great it is.

  • Maximet

    Petrol companies are onto efficient deisel engines, pushing the price of deisel to $1.50 a litre way past unleaded….With lpg 1/3 of the price , this will be a great car.My third lpg falcon.AU,BF,FG

  • LPG

    For those talking about Diesel vs LPG pricing.

    At a local Sydney petrol station tonight:

    LPG : 63.9 cents per litre
    Diesel : 156.9 cents per litre

    Alittle bit of maths, the Falcon with 13L per 100km fuel consumption will cost $8.31 per 100km. For a Diesel car to match this in terms of cost, it will need to return 5.29L per 100km. Im NOT aware of ANY large family vehicle that could do this lel alone many smaller sedans.

    If I wanted to buy an XR6, I could do so on LPG with fuel consumption of 13L per 100km and a fuel price of 63.9 cents per Litre with the Falcon. An equivalent Commodore returns 13.4L per 100km (as only the Omega has LPG) and will cost around the same price as Diesel. Now for some more maths, the rough average for Austrlians in a year is 25,000kms. With LPG prices and Falcon fuel consumption of 13L per 100km, it equates to $2,076 for 25,000kms. With the unleaded Commodore with 13.4L per 100km and around 150 cents per litre it will cost $5,025. Thats quite a difference. This also makes the 3.0L SIDI in the Omega redundant, as it returns similar fuel consumption to the Falcon but still with expensive unleaded and also has 120Nm less torque.

    They are onto a real winner with this one. The only stumbling blocks I see are marketing and more importantly, pricing. I would be disappointed if they priced these vehicles (as I fear they may) in a way that it takes 5 years to actually recoup the petrol savings by charging a massive premium over ULP models. This should be used as knock out punch and be priced competitively against Commodre/Aurion ULP vehicles.

    • XR

      Ford need to feed these kind of stats down peoples throats. We are talking about over half the cost in fuel to run yet the exact same power and class leading talk as the regular Falcon. Im not even a marketer but I could think of 10 ways to advertise this already. And unlike the Commodore 3.0L SIDI gimmick, which was caught out in the test at Bathurst, if they were to test this in normal driving conditions it will return the same performance as every other Falcon because the torque is there. Real winner. I just wish this was released back in 2008 to make the most of the media hype.

    • F1MotoGP

      If LPG so good I can not understand why people using petrol and diesel? Must be the buying price. The Holden cost over $42,000. If you after running cost and sedan Jetta cost $35,900. Using your figures Jetta cost only $170 more a year to run at 20,000 km pa. Jetta cheaper by $6000/170 = 35.3 year.

      • LPG

        A Jetta ISNT a large sedan so that is comparing apples to oranges to begin with.

        LPG is good. Its major contraints are yes price for one and two is the significant loss of power. Number two has been rectified. Its time for Ford and Holden to price it competitively instead of pricing it out of the market.

        • Andrew M

          The word out there is expect about a 2.5-3K premium for the New Ford E-Gas.

          Considering diesel premiums can commonly be 4K, I doubt purchase price will cross this off anyones short list

  • PoisonEagle

    Beefy engine, good CO2 figures, If they are smart they will try and get it just below 200g. Me wanty.

    I don’t know why Ford can’t streamline all engines across Falcon and Territory lines, would create more demand,no?
    What if someone wants an ecoboost Territory, a Diesel Falcon, LPG Territory etc?
    Considering they share platforms and most components, there shouldn’t be so much cost involved that it prevents this…

  • azzaa

    To be honest, if it all about running cost why do you need a 195kw lpi when u have a less powerfull more economic And quicker 4cl Turbo petrol. I thought the logical step would be 4cly T lpi that is slightly slower roughly same economy cheaper to run.

    • F1MotoGP

      I agree with you if people are after running cost than buy 4 cyl car cost $16,000 less than Holden LPG. After 23 years Holden LPG start saving!!!

      • Andrew M

        Not everyone wants their knees crammed up in a 4cyl hatch back.

        Also, if you claim a Holden LPG optioned vehicle takes 23 years to pay back then please show the maths.
        Perhaps you forgot to put a decimal point between the 2 and 3?? that would be more representative of the pay back period

    • TMG

      Running costs aside, most people like tow or like to dream about towing, the big lazy I6 can do it without an issue, the T4 will struggle with 5 up, boot loaded and camper trailer on the back. If it’s never going to leave the city then buy the T4 when it arraives.

      It’s all about choice. and good to see Ford can offer and I6, LPI I6 Turbo I6, V8 (in FPV for now) and soon T4, spoilt for choice, buy the Big T’s and you get V6 Aurion only or a I4 in Camry, Holden do a V8, 2x V6 and Dual LPG V6

  • BK

    Yippy I can save now 25 bucks a week on fuel. LPG not for me. I stick to premium 98

    • Don Quay

      If you are only saving $25pw, then that is about the price difference between 25 litres of ULP98 and LPG. If that is all the fuel you use each week, you are obviously one who only travels small distances each week. So you are right, LPG is not for you.

    • J

      LPG = 108RON – so what’s your point again? You’d prefer to pay more for an inferior fuel? Your choice I suppose…

    • LPG

      It translates in to far higher savings per week than just $25.

  • GooSE

    If this is marketed on its own merits and not some stupid ad with fingers walking through the countryside it can be a major success for Ford Aus

  • F1MotoGP

    If LPG so good why people not buying? Must be the purchase price which is over $40,000 and you do a calculation and people switch to smaller cars. Other reason LPG prices rising faster on average since Sept 1997 2.5%pa more than ULP.

    • Andrew M

      Firstly things that start with a smaller number always increase percentage (appear larger) wise than larger numbers if the same increase is given.

      For eg if a fuel costing 1 cent per litre went up to 2cpl, thats an increase of 100%.

      Where as if a fuel costing 10cpl went up to 15 cpl, thats only a 50% increase even though the 10cpl fuel actually went up more.

      Care to tell how many cents per litre LPG has gone up versus actual CPL unleaded has gone up??

  • Stan

    Pfft it would probably fall apart like any other Falcon

    • TMG

      Pifft yep will fall apart like my 89 EA falcon did in 2006, how can they get away with that, sure it started life as taxi and did a gizillion miles, and then I bought it for 50 bucks at the pub when it was 10 years old, yep never gunna by one again, they just keep falling apart…..

      Move on, I’m glad Ford are taking there time to get these vehicles to market, nobody wants to buy a dud anymore, and if it means we wait for a year (or more for TDCi Terry) Do it properly and we dodn’t have to deal with the Stans of the world.

      • Roger Ramjet

        So lets get this straight, you bought reputably the worst built Falcon after the XF in decades, which was a 10 year old X-taxi with a zillion of abused km and complain about it falling apart?
        Please enlighten everyone on which car would be as good as new after going through what your poor Falcon did?
        Plus you paid $50 for it you tight wad, lucky that it even started!

        • Andrew M

          I think you missed the sarcasm Roger

  • Hung Low

    Well done Ford…honestly I was expecting better fuel consumption than listed as some after market LPi systems can be tuned so lpg consumption is almost with parity to petrol.
    Either way it still has the cheapest running cost for a large car full stop!
    The advantage of lpg is that the low range torque will be even stronger than petrol, this will feel more torquey than the petrol variant at normal speeds.

    The tuners will have fun with the 12:1 compression (which rules out any chance of dual fuel) a few bolt ons like more aggressive cams to suit the compression and a tune of the lpg system will have this engine spitting out 230kw+ easily.

  • Gary

    Great move by Ford,must be a shore winner,half the running costs,no lpg odour,clean engine oil,plenty of power and torque,similar system as the HSV[produced by same company].The next step will be FLEX-DI[google it] one engine any fuel[check it out]Bye, I’m of to talk to my stock broker.$$$$$$$

  • Harry B

    This is a good addition to the Ford Motor Company

    Maybe the release of a more economic engine MIGHT be able to win over and prolong the Ford’s life span

    Go Ford go!!

  • macca

    does anybody know if the gas tank/s will still be under the boot floor?

    • Andrew M

      I believe they will be. They will be better packaged but I think they may go the way of Holden and eliminate the spare and replace it with a can of puncture repair.

      I dont believe they can place LPG tanks under passenger seating so it will always be at the rear.

      The Falcon utes dont have this issue as the spare fits under the tray as usual because they are able to place LPG tanks further forward because the seating laws arent an issue.

      I also believe this may be part of the issue with why Terry isnt available on LPG. The extra rear row of seats means ithe tanks will be under passenger seats.

      You can put LPG on a Terry aftermarket because the ADR’s are different if its factory fit versus aftermarket home job

  • Andrew M

    And another thorn in the side of the diesel fans that cant stop bagging this is that whilst this is more economical to run, it has 409nm of torque versus something like a Jetta with only 280nm, and the the default workhorse diesel Hilux with only 343nm of stump pulling power.

    People harp on about “yeah but diesel is all about the torque giving drivability”

    • Roger Ramjet

      Add to that across WIDER power band and obviously higher average power as well!
      LPG + cubic inches in passenger vehicles = diesel beater

  • Jack

    Great news. Could this be the best NA inline six they’ve ever produced? I’d love this motor in a wagon. What a car to take all over the country.

  • Car Fanatic

    Passat has 350nm from 1800 Rpm, does 5.5l/100 km and has a 60 litre tank, that’s good for more than 1000 k’s and a servo in Granville yesterday had Diesel for 143.9 per litre, that’s $7.91 per 100 kilometers and in three years the Passats resale will be much greater.

    To get your 409nm of torque, you have to Rev your LPI up to 3250rpm and it needs full 4.0 and six cylinders to get that Torque.

    And for IMA HOGG, you really don’t understand how cost per 100 km’s works do you?

    Of course the Diesel cost more per litre, it can be twice the price but if it gets you two and a half times the distance then your running costs are lower.

    At least Andrew M puts up good arguments.

    Keep up the good work Andrew.

    • LPG

      I previously showed the LPG vs Diesel comparison. The LPG is marginally cheaper to run than Diesel with 5.29L per 100km required from a Diesel to match the LPG in terms of cost.

      The Passat cannot be compared to the Falcon. It is not a large family car which is reflected in the fact that it weighs 100kg less than the Falcon.

      Youre comments regarding torque are also somewhat misleading. I do not have the dyno graph of the Falcon but it probably has the Passat’s 350Nm at idle. Yes its PEAK torque of 409Nm is at 3250rpm but it has a very flat torque curve regardless. In saying that yes diesel generally has more torque but also has less power.

    • Roger Ramjet

      I think its time to go drive the latest I6 mate. As mentioned, over 300nm off idle and when the diesel runs out of rpm and torque tapers off, the I6 is still charging. No doubt a thirstier larger capacity turbo diesel engine will out do the I6 but purpose of this argument is given grunt for running cost.

    • Andrew M

      Car Fanatic,
      I commend you on showing your head again even after your arguments copped a flogging.

      Firstly, the Passatt doesnt achieve 5.5L/100K on average, 6.3 is combined usage, 5.5 is more like H’way consumption.
      Also, the Falcon and Commodore sized vehicles are still bigger than the Passat, so pretty impressive they still hold their weight to the smaller passatt

      Also on resale the Passatt loses 20K over 3 years, and the LPG Falcon loses 22K over the same period (based on the 2008 year models)
      Not really that much difference. Im sure the Falcon being cheaper to service and insure would bring back that 2K over the 3 years.

      You think 3250 to make 409nm is bad??
      Well for starters LPG will rev quicker than Diesel meaning 3250 isnt that high for a petrol or LPG vehicle.
      Diesels have a very narrow band of power meaning they are flat very quickly.
      Also Im pretty sure most of the torque is there around 2000rpm in the LPG model.

      And if you think its p*ss por the Falcon need a bigger motor to make 409nm, then why dont you take the turbo charger off your Diesel and see how P*ss poor the performance is then??
      Or alternativly you could throw a Turbo on the LPG Falcon and level the field that way.

      You are forgetting Diesel gets a massive amount of assistance from being turbo charged. Remember the days when some models were non turbo diesel?? Absolute slugs.

      An LPG falcon with a turbo would make 600nm from 2000rpm no probs, and thats with out boosting the heck out of it.

      I know someone who just switched his work van from unleaded to diesel and is spewing the price differential everywhere he goes is around 15cpl.

      I have noticed the diesel price to be about $1.55, and its the same price diesel owners I was sitting with today were commenting on

  • Car Fanatic

    Firstly the 6.3l/100 is for the current Passat CC,The Germans achieved 51mpg or 5.5 combined for the facelifted B7 and 4.7l/100 for the Bluemotion TDI which sadly we don’t get here in Australia. Also I prefer my torque to kick in low, 3200 is still more than halfway to recline in a petrol, 1800 in a diesel is well below the halfway.

    Another point is VW achieved their claimed ADR, I bet when the LPI is tested it comes in more realistically at 14-14.5.

    Finally, I have no idea where your friends by their diesel but it’s not hard to find independent servos selling Diesel in the mid 40′s rather than mid 50′s and your mate with the Van will not only get much further on a tank of diesel than his old petrol van, but when he is laden down, the Diesel van won’t struggle to haul the weight like the petrol van would.

    I filled up yesterday in Granville for 143.9 while my closest local oil refinery owned servo was asking 158.9 for Diesel and 151.9 for unleaded so I can’t see a 15 cent difference there?

    • Andrew M

      He certainly does get more out of the diesel. Used to get 450k’s per tank, now gets 600k’s.
      Thats Unleaded economics versus diesel, thats not what Im arguing about.

      You are dead right, 6.3L is for the Passatt HERE. No point in talking about the price of eggs in china if we arent in china.
      With different countries becomes a different set of variables.

      Maybe VW do achieve their claimed economy, but Ford also has a record of achieving or in some cases bettering their economy whether it be a Focus, Mondeo or Falcon.

      I used to have a 2002 model E-Gas and used to better the claimed economy.
      With plenty of torque, and well down low I doubt there will be a problem achieving the LPi’s claimed economy.

      Whats your experiences with LPG that makes you loathe it so much?? Also, What sort of diesel vehicle do you drive?? Is it a Jetta or is that just a random example??

  • Car Fanatic

    I had a an HSV VT Clubby converted to LPG to keep running costs down and while power loss was minimal I found the engine response a little down. Yes it was cheaper to run but it list a bit of it’s character. I own a 2.0 TDi golf and we are waiting on the new Passat. I was never a fan of diesel until I moved to the U K and drove a TDI Golf mark 4. I was mildly impressed and even more impressed with the BMW 320D. I am a diesel convert and nota huge advocate of tree hugging, I love the idea of low down torque and excellent fuel economy from a small engined car, simple as that. I have a wife and 2 kids and don’t need something as big as the falcon. It’s a waste of space. I’d take a Mondeo as it’s as big as I feel would be needed, But VW has the edge in diesel over Ford. I am not a badge snob and would by a Kia or Hyundai tomorro if they had everything right about there cars.

  • Car Fanatic

    Incidentally, AFI are in receivership, Ford say this doesn’t affect supply of the LPG tanks but we will see closer to the LPi’s release.

  • veron

    Ford has to be kidding, paying more for LPG injection than petrol based.
    xt LPGi for $42K.
    $33k drive away for xr6 and government basicallys pays for lpg gas vapour conversion.
    An XT lpi more than the cost of a petrol G6E. What are they thinking?