New proposed tax changes for motorists

By Alborz Fallah | March 10th, 2008

A new proposal put before the Federal government recommends that motorists should pay based on usage and not the one-rate-for-all system currently in place. Essentially the new system will work similarly to mobile phone plans, you pay a setup fee and then pay as you go.

Using automatic vehicle identification systems (able to read number plates) drivers will be automatically charged a special levy when they drive on congested roads, they will be charged less in non-peak periods and Toyota Prius owners and owners of other ‘environmentally friendly cars‘ would receive discounts for their ‘limited‘ impact on the environment.

The proposal has been put forward by the Australian Automobile Association, which includes Australia’s eight driver service organisations, (NRMA, RACV, RACQ…) and has already gained the endorsement of the government advisory group, the National Transport Commission.

Payments will include an “access charge” for driving via certain roads as well as a “user charge” which will act like a setup fee. The new system, if given the green light, will replace the current charges drivers pay:

federal fuel excise,
GST on petrol,
state registration charges,
stamp duty on registration and road tolls.

The exact amount motorists will be charged is yet to be determined, but given there will be no federal fuel excise, registration fee and GST on petrol, expect to pay up to a few dollars for travelling on your normal stretch of road – each day.

Factors that determine your charge include the size of the vehicle and the wear it causes roads, an environmental charge related to the size of your engine, a levy to cover the costs of crashes and congestion charges.

Sounds like in ingenious idea doesn’t it? Well it all depends on what you drive and how much you drive. The current system will charge an 80 year old grandmother who puts 5,000km/year on the odometer the same registration fee as an above-average motorists who travels over 50,000km/year.

The proposal sounds too good to be true, mainly because the money the government makes from excise on petrol is enormous. This year it is expected to raise $14.42 billion, out of which only an estimated $3.41 billion will be spent on roads.

Furthermore Australian manufacturers are sure to rally against the plan as it will put yet another strain on locally made 6/8-cylinder vehicles.

Would you agree to a pay-as-you-go system if it meant not having to pay the fuel excise and registration fee?

http://www.geardiary.com Mitchell Oke

Are they going to have a discount for students? During the year I mostly use my car to drive to the station and back, so it may work out cheaper for me. I’d just be happy with some kind of student discount on rego/fuel. Hard to run a car when at uni for over 25hrs a week.
http://www.geardiary.com Mitchell Oke

And rego is a few hundred, less than half of the total needed to register a car (rego + CTP).
Richo

Narrow sited – discount for a prius due to its low environmental impact despite the fact that its TOTAL environmental impact from the date of manufacture to its eventual disposal is greater then a toyota camry because the environmental impact of its batteries are enourmous!

Also what about the people who make a living on the roads? Couriers, taxi drivers, truck drivers etc? Yeah sure they use the roads more often but without them, particularly truck drivers, the country grinds to a hault! Thats a fact you can take to the bank!

If its going to replace the fuel excise that is currently giving 14 billion to the government then its going to have to be a fairly bloody significant charge isn’t it! Also what about all the people, like pensioners, who have owned their V6 car for the last 10 years and can’t afford to replace it, they bought their car with no knowledge that such a system was going to come in, yet they are gonna get lumped with it and can’t afford to change cars to do anything about it!

Sorry but this sounds alot like ideological garbage to me.. but then thats right up Kevin Rudd’s alley so it will probably happen!
Richo

it’ll never happen, but in my opinion if the fed government is getting 14 billion out of the fuel excise then they should be spending 14 billion on transport inferstructure! Thats what the fuel excise was originally supposed to do lets not forget! It’s blatent hypocrocy that the federal government blames the state governments for the lack of transport inferstructure in australia when they gain 14 billion for transport inferstructure out of the fuel excise but don’t bloody use it!

Also old K Rudd is slashing the budget here there and everywhere to “combat inflation” which any economics graduate will be able to tell you won’t bloody make a difference anyway, yet its a commonly quoted fact that australia’s lack of transport inferstructure, including roads rail and ports, is a major inhibitor to our economy…
http://www.geardiary.com Mitchell Oke

I just love how they keep adding these charges and fees to cars, when the main reason we have them is to get to work, get to education to eventually work or both. The only reason they think they can do this is they know that people will have to grin and bare it.
Realcars

Reckon we will all end up paying more regardless as with any “new” tax as I doubt the idea will remain in it’s purest form and politicians being what they are of course.
Richo

the funny thing is, we already have user pays! The more you drive, the more fuel you use, therefore the more fuel excise you pay! DUH!

As for the rego side of it, a significant portion of rego is the compulsory third party insurance attached to it, and the other is a relitively small fee to allow your car on the road, and the rest is the fuel excise which as i’ve already explained is already user pays!

again, its just ideological garbage!
http://www.geardiary.com Mitchell Oke

Maybe Rudd will reduce the fuel tax and registration fees, to help curb spending?

ROTFLOL.
No Name

ah so TP the green Prius gets a discount but the Volkswagen Bluemotion series of cars (yet to get to Australia I think) are greener and more environmentally friendly take a stiff charge. I’ve already proven the BLuemotion Polo to be greener than the Prius by a 10 plus margin. What about the Lexus LS 600h a V8 hybrid, you cannot exactly call a 5.0 litre V8 environmentally friendy. Thats Toyota being hypocritical at its best.
jbot

Pretty sure Lexus never try to pretend the LS 600h is environmentally friendly. I’m pretty sure even Lexus says their hybrids are more performance oriented instead of their sole purpose being to reduce fuel consumption.
Wheelnut

It could happen. However; the system put forward in the proposal is a bit too complicated.. a system which tracks Number plates… how would they treat hire cars?

An easier solution would be for the RTA to record your odometer reading when you register your car and again when you renew it. Then they could workout how the distance you travelled and charge a flat rate accordingly
http://navelcontemplation.blogspot.com/2007/03/i-don-get-fashion.html supercujo

I have an idea. Instead of tracking cars on main roads (which can be gotten around), why don’t we put a tax on something all cars need? How about a petrol tax? I think it may have already been done.

Hang on a sec. I think I just worked it out. They are doing this now before more efficient or electric cars start coming out, so they can keep their revenue stream.
Andrew M

im with you Richo,
what about the many users of the roadways that require vehicles to turn a living?

whether it be those that are couriers or tradies or even company product representatives where they travel to many workplaces during the day and need to carry more than a “nap sac”

like any new scheme there will always be winners and losers.
for eg if they say it includes tolls and you are a 6 tolls a day kind of guy driving a 4cyl hatch back then you would be laughing.
on the flip side if you hardly use tolls and have to run the country roads where you clock up the K’s quickly yet dont bother the inner city infrastructure but choose to drive the appropriate vehicle being a V6 sedan or 4X4 then you lose big time
http://. Naughtyius Maximus

Things that make you go hmmmm…..close the door.

Another day in the world of Rudd and slash and burn to kerb inflation and a simplistic approach to his conundrums….which has not helped so far with more then 2 rises since elected.
Andrew M

supercujo,
mate thats exactly it.
they know what is coming and its the future revenue they are worried about.

there are many models to study on similar things where the government has changed their revenue collecting calculations.

the latest way was with the water restrictions
i read some time ago that due to every one now collecting rain water in their tanks that it is not finding the dams and subsequently the councils are missing out on revenue.
hence a water tank Tax isnt too far away

but you know what they did first hey? yep made water tanks compulsary and those that didnt have to comply by law,
they kindly gave them one for free ha ha ha ha

and even funnier is that they rushed such laws through before 2008 because they knew very well that the drought breaker is just around the corner
Andrew M

NM,
all the rate rises prove is that the government has buggerall control over the reserve bank.

the funny thing is that most of the population believed that a kevin 07 vote would put a stop to the rises ha ha ha
No Name

“Furthermore Australian manufacturers are sure to rally against the plan as it will put yet another strain on locally made 6/8-cylinder vehicles.”

I don’t actually have a lot of sympathy with this statement, there is more demand for smaller engines so change or die…bit like Mitsubishi syndrome.

Cats and pigeons!!
Richo

hey Andrew that sure isn’t gonna stop rudd using rising inflation as an excuse to slash all of the budget promises made by the previous government, i mean slashing carer payments… how low can you go? Then they turn around and try and blame howard who convieniantly isn’t around anymore to defend himself..

I hate to say it told you so to all the rudd supporters, but this man is 100% hot air and nothing else, he is very good at trotting out the slogans and the political spin, oh and don’t forget atleast 10 references to “working familiest” per speach, but behind it all he is a massively idiological politition who in reality has very limited experience. People are now starting to realise that all of the promises Rudd made leading up to the election where purely made to win the election, rudd knew full well that he could simply back out of all of the promises by saying “oh the previous lot stuffed it all up”. Well sorry Kevin but as oposition leader you knew exactly what the howard government was doing when you made those promises therefore you knew full well that you wouldn’t be able to honour them. Blaming the previous government is nothing more then a cheap cop out
Richo

No Name, holden and toyota have already changed, they are both export focused manufacturers now which allows them to continue to build large cars. Also V8 sales for holden are higher then they have ever been in the companies history
Glen

Richo, thats because the holden 6 is rubbish.

I can tell you now if this system comes in the fuel excise will not go. Govt are known to double dip
golfschwein

hey Richo, I’m trading my Kevin07 tee shirt in for a Brendon07. The seven? Oh, that’s his approval rating as preferred Prime Minister! Mr 7% man woo hoooooo.

Kev’s doing a fabulous job as PM and is on track to keep all election pledges. We’ve had Sorry Day and work choices is binned next week!

GO Kev! I think this plan shows some alternative thinking with good foresight. It’s just what I think. No one has to argue with me, cos I’m not going to read your crazy comments anyway!
Richo

Glen, if you really think thats the reason people buy V8 commodores then your a tool
Kasparov

If only he would spruce up the broadband as he promised…if only.

I doubt this system will be introduced, and if it will, the price of petrol will fall. Then after a few years go up again. Plus where are the states going to get their income from if GST is removed from fuel? Thats a big chunk of it gone, I’m sure they won’t be too happy about it.

I would not like to see this system at all.
Foggy

We have governments that can’t even get the systems for a Smart Card working, there is no way in hell that the IT infrastructure and systems to manage all of this will ever get off the ground.

I’m working on a similar project at the moment for “smart” electricity meters that charge you more at peak times amongst other things, and thanks to political interference and sheer incompetence this type of thing will probably not happen in my lifetime.

What about my idea from another post of allowing a registration/insurance to be shared between 2 cars. Then we could own a little city runabout to be used for 90% of our driving, and a big muthafuncar Hummer for when we want to cruise the Corso at Manly for all those chicks that dig it.
Richo

Foggy i think your onto the idea of sharing rego and insurance accross two cars. Take the case of one of my mates who is single and lives by himself. He owns a mazda 3 which he uses as his daily transport but he also owns a 4wd as he is one of those blokes who loves nothing more then going offroad for dirty weekends. Now he can hardly drive both cars at the same time now can he? So the fact he has two cars isn’t INCREASING the amount of driving he is doing, so why should he pay more? He’s actually doing the right thing by driving a small fuel efficient car around during the week as opposed to a large 4wd
jamison

Australian roads of the future will be basically automated.
I’ve made the call a while back, its been discussed in the automotive sector also.

Basically, Australia is probably one of the first countries in the world that will have its road pretty much under “control”.

The push for public transport and environmentally friendly vehicles will continue to get stronger in the next few years, they might not tell you directly, but subtle changes, new emission controls they all add up to the future of Australian, and possible global roads.

The irony is, Australia has a mediocre rail system to begin with. Would probably require tens of billions of dollars in the next 15 years if they do push for public transportations hard during that time span.

I’ve always thought that charging or “limiting” the amount of cars going to the city at the same time was a good alternative. Push for employers to “shift” work their workers in a 3 hour window. So Hour 1, Hour 2 and Hour 3, congestion, theoritically should be cut down 1/3 at a time, and people who violate their shift time should get a fine… or taxed. But its a rough idea, obviously employers wouldnt like it.. but the its good for everyone on the road.
No Name

Richo/Foggy that would never work sharing on two cars, those less than desirable types would use both cars at the same time and save themselves a small fortune.
Doh

what next – a user tax on the volume of Co2 an individual expels?
Kenzo

all that is going to happen is that they implement the new system and the fuel remains the same rate/price increase as it normally would without the new tax system. with all this hoo haa about being green just makes me want to pollute the environment even though ive always been against pollution
http://www.ihatemycar.com.au ihatemycardotcomdotau

In Germany Insurance company\’s long time ago have charged much higher premiums for cars with larger engine capacity.
Kinetic

Since when does anything go down in price?
They’d only pass such a law if they knew it would bring in the government more money than the ??Billion they’re getting a year.
Kinetic

“Doh Says:
what next – a user tax on the volume of Co2 an individual expels?”

Airs free! – not for long.
Reckless1

Bloody hell – a tax on the volume of Co2 ????

Hope they don’t try and charge on the volume of methane. We’ll all have to stop eating beans, and man’s last free, enjoyable pastime will be taken from us. And imagine the cost of the charcoal tablets we’ll all have to take – there’ll be a carbon tax on them as well ……..
Gibbo

What a jip!!! Kev and all his buddies get to drve (or be driven) around in V8 Statesmans, so why should we be slogged even more ontop of fuel prices for wanting to drive large/performance cars when the the pollies can do it for free.
Anthonii

This really is f***ing s***.

Business’s will right it off as a tax refund, the only people that care will be the families trying to get to work to pay for their ever increasing mortgage.

F*** me if I’m worng but did we not just run up a huge tax surplus? So why do people feel the need to f*** the low income earners in the a** trying to get to work?

Crock of S***.
Anthonii

oh, if they want us off the main roads thats fine, make some bloody alternatives! I have one road that takes me to work, there is no alternative, I have tried.
http://impreza dlr1

Another fantastic proposal by the motorists “best friends” the AAA and NRMA. I still cant believe people listen to these idiots. When was the last time they came out with something that was pro-motorists?

Their track record give them no credibility at all. Higher than average insurance premiums for non members or new members, no more vehicle pre-purchase inspections that they charged over $200 for & their road service isn’t game to do more than a jumpstart or change a tyre.
Pat E

“Furthermore Australian manufacturers are sure to rally against the plan as it will put yet another strain on locally made 6/8-cylinder vehicles.”

I think this could go the other way if fuel prices drop, people will drive big cars again becasue of lower fuel prices. People stopped buying V8′s because of fuel, not the price of the cars – its a mental thing.

I agree with Anthonii’s comment re alternative travel, and what was said earlier about transport infrastructure. After a recent trip to japan, it is even more obvious how bad our rail system is. In tokyo the train is either on-time or early, not late, the trains are impeccably clean and reliable. They have a smart card idea called “Suica” it is a swipe card system that can be used like a phone cap. You pay X amount of dollar5s per month, and get X amount worth of train rides. The cards just have to touch the pad on the gate, and most people keep them in their wallet and run the wallet across the top of the platform gate. It works really really well.
Manic Mustang

So people will get penalised for having a 9 to 5 job,because they have to drive during peak periods. And anyone owning a old muscle car, which is only a weekend cruiser, gets penalised even more because they arent the most ‘environmentally’ friendly cars. What a world we live in when the government has to keep coming up with ways to screw over the average person
kharn

I dont think this will happen or work.
As richo stated, we already have a user pays system. Its the levy on fuel. Drive more or use more fuel, youre paying more levy.

My biggest gripe with the charges in running a vehicle are the greenslip prices in NSW. Most other states have it included in their rego, and guess what, its far cheaper than it is in NSW.
Flying High

Thought One: Weren’t we supposed to get rid of all these ‘taxes’ when GST came in – oh that’s right they are not taxes.

Thought Two: How about some decent, respectable and reliable public transport that allows you not to have to drive to work

Parting Comment: Up the Public Transport to a usable state first THEN think about doing this. However. as usual, instead of a riot that threatens to tear down parliament when useless pollies impose things like this, Aussies will just cop it sweet.
AGM

This really sucks. As driving enthusiasts we are being blatantly discriminated against all the time. From crap like this, or being made to feel guilty for enjoying the art and science of motoring, to the huge lack of facilities available for us to use our cars (football and soccer players get government funded playing fields…I’ll eat my mousemat if government ever funded a motorsport facility!). It doubly hurts since I didn’t vote for this dude and still am being punished for Labor getting in! Get the public transport system working effectively on a NATIONAL level before enacting such a mindless suggestion.
Chopstar87

i thonk they do this charge as you go on the motor ways you will see people just start taking the back streets, so we will more cars in the suburbs then then motor way…. because if me a mate had to get some where and he had to pay for the motor way…. we would take the WRX instead of the falcon and just fly thru the back streets… and then we have more fun and dont have to use the roads you have to pay for…. what a joke…. so i can see people driving on the back streets or thru the suburbs because they dont want to pay for use that road…..
MotoWebbi

If we are to have a truly “user pays” system, why factor in an amount for the cost of motor vehicle accidents?
Better still to charge the clowns who constantly cause accidents the FULL cost of their stupidity/ignorance/carelessness…..!
Duck

How much falcons can you find in the picture?
Duck

I can see 7.
TP

Im for it… get those idiots who are driving to work in their petrol guzzling Falcons off the road and onto public transport
Oz.

TP: what really is your problem with Falcons?
TP

They aint no Aurion, that is the problem… new model in particulr is an ugly DUCKling (forgive the pun duck)
Duck

TP,
Look i dont like falcons, but i dont go on like you do!
It was just a fun game, because i could see a few falcons in the picture, now u ruined it!
Duck

WOW TP look there is 5 Toyotas!
Bret

Now don’t get me wrong, I’m not in favour of this, and I understand that everyone’s situation is different, BUT can you actually spot ANY car in that pic with more than one person?

And TP, on highway my Falcon guzzles less petrol than your old s’box Camry, oh thats right, in your narrow experience, you think that camry’s don’t leave the city, and you havn’t either. Might go and prep the caravan for the Easter exodus…….good thing I’m not stuck trying to tow it with a Camry!
Bret

TP, the day a Falcon is ever as ugly as the Camry/Aurion is the day to leave town. The Camry’Aurion biggest failing, apart from FWD, is it’s butt ugly American styling (you did know the camry is styled in the US didn’t you…….?)
Foggy

No Name:
“Richo/Foggy that would never work sharing on two cars, those less than desirable types would use both cars at the same time and save themselves a small fortune.”

If they only have one pair of numberplates, then if they got caught driving without them, or they used the number plate on a car other than the two registered, then it would be the equivalent of driving an unregistered vehicle…. which many of these “undesirables” do anyway!

We just need to invent a lockable number plate holding bracket that makes switching a breeze.
Oz.

Hey Foggy: how do you get bold/italic writing?

TP: because you don’t like the look of them? Um, yeah ok.
Duck

Hey! Bret! I never knew the styling of the aurion/camry was from the U.S. Hey! You learn something new every day!

And the 380 was desighned by the yanks too!
Duck

Bret, Do you mean there is 2 or more people in a car?
Duck

Oz.,
I thought it would work in a Word Document writing the sentence than highlight it then push the bold writing button.

But i tried it didnt work!
Oz.

Foggy must have a special keyboard
Andrew M

Anthonii,
mate what i said about the businesses that have no excuse to use the road would suffer, is that they would pass it on to the consumer meaning every one hurts more for what they buy.

the same goes with the GST. people say oh poor businesses having to deal with that where as if you are in business GST is awesome. it is only the end of line consumer that actually pays GST.

so yep as you say its the poor old families.
the affects of higher charges/taxes would double its impact of what is proposed as the families have to pay for themselves and the businesses that pass on increases through higher prices for their products.

and when kevin 07 is apparently curbing inflation this would do absolutely no good for it.

the rich always get richer and the poor get poorer
Andrew M

good to see Duck and OZ dealing with the real problems in todays society………

QUOTE……….
“how do you get bold/italic writing?”
No Name

Foggy two sets of plates mate.
Bret

Duck, US also get to answer for the crappy Kluger style and (I think) RAV’s.

And the text formatting is done in browser software not limited by the lack of imagination of Mr Gates crew.
No Name

I’ve got a special keyboard, it works perfectly jsut teh prtat usnig ti taht cna’t tpye. He He
Duck

I dont mind the Klugers styling. But……..
Camry- No
Aurion- No
Rav4/6- No
Duck

Guess What…………………
Duck

If Toyota doesnt make the aurion RWD soon they will get big losses (specially the TRD in sales).
Duck

U know how they use falcon and Commodores as Highway Patrol Police Cars, thats understandable because they are rear wheel drive, but they do u know and i have seen Aurion police Highway patrol Police Cars. How can they? I thought it wouldnt be safe? (Because the are front wheel drive).
Foggy

@No Name

You can just include inline html tags for things like bold and italic, and they will be rendered correctly by your browser.

Now, the problem with the 2 sets of plates idea, is that the “undesirables” can for the most part, get away with driving two cars on one rego, because there’s nothing immediately suspicious to the cops or the RTA…. other than their mullet!
Wheelnut

There is a difference between a squad car and a Highway patrol car and in most states now the HP cars have a rather sporty distinctive and highly visible/reflective chequered livery all over the car whereas a Squad car which remains predominantly white with nothing else but Police decals

Compared to the HP cars [mostly Falcons and Commodores] The few Aurions I have seen appear to be just regular squad cars used for call outs to domestice etc
Eyma Teapot

Duck, you are right, i believe they do use the mighty Aurion super car as pursue cars on our highways today and i for one feel safer knowing they are out there.
Knowone is going to outrun an aurion as i believe that any crook making a mad dash to the border will never make it as when he looks into his rear-view mirror and sees the ECILOP hot in purchute,he would have to pull over to the side of the road in fits of laughter making easy picking for our men in blue.
Actually, i am being harsh.
Afterall, this car will do 0-100 in 1.7 seconds and uses just 4.2 l/p100 doing it. Right TP?
WILDB

What a load of crap this proposal is!
Charging people who HAVE to work to earn a living more because they have to drive in peak hour. Or the people who cannot afford to buy a new car.

By the way (to that moron going on about how bad and ugly the Falcon is) my Falcon uses less fuel highway and city than the Aurion\’s which many of the people I know own. Not to mention they are an ugly car with a torqueless engine and doughy steering and not to mention catastrophic understeer with the ESP turned off. Hmm what a great car…. NOT!
TP

Bret you obviously havent see the new Falcon… gone backwards in design, Aurion has it all over it. As for fuel effcieicny, Aurion again leads way. What exactly does the Falcon have over the Aurion? Power. No again. Dynamics? No, base model Aurion nearly beat a XR6 in wheels mag test. Come to think of it, the Falcon has nothing over the Aurion!
Oz.

No TP
the falcon does have one thing…RWD
Eyma Teapot

TP, How about that you dont have to wear a cardigan or corderoy trouser to drive a XR6!
Duck

Good one Oz!
TP

Haha Oz, RWD… less efficiency (both fuel efficiency and power to the ground) and from the Wheels car test, slower around a track!!! Good one TP.

Eyma great call idiot, what the Falcon has is an extra big seat to sit the fat ar*s that inheritantly occupy its seats.
Andrew M

wheelnut,
all the police cars now exhibit fluro orange stripes to increase visibility. yep even the day to day squad car that attends domestics.
it is a new design they are phasing in. here in QLD prob 90% of what i see around are already sporting the new paint schemes, and from what ive seen on the news and those police shows Qld isnt the only one adopting the new louder desings.
Duck

Hey TP,
Why dont you change your name back to Toyota Paul?
Duck

And some police cars are red with the normal blue and white checkered strip across the car.
Duck

TP, But RWD is safer than FWD!
Duck

Personally i think toyota is a bit soft on their sporty aurion styling!
Duck

Wheelnut,
I still see a few aurion Highway Patrol cars.
Duck

Didn’t they used to have Subaru Impreza WRX sedans in the Victoria Police Force, but now they stopped using them for some reason.
Anthonii

“Andrew M Says:
Anthonii,
mate what i said about the businesses that have no excuse to use the road would suffer”

No comment to you at all mate, all i was saying, which is in tune with yours is. Business don’t care, Families get stung.
Eyma Teapot

Gee Wiz Duck, You spoiled the secret. I doubt anyone had Guessed that the t in TP stood for Toyota!
Anthonii

We need an edit feature…

What i was trying to say was, that my comment was not in reference to yours Andrew, i was simply ranting about who this hurts and how they are all ready hurting.
Oz.

TP: look at what Duck said, “TP, But RWD is safer than FWD!”

And that is something the Falcon has over the CamAurion!
Oz.

Eyma Teapot, yep that was his name, Toyota Paul…Until he got banned for 24 hours by the site author, Alborz.
Eyma Teapot

OZ, What did TP do to get banned.
He wasnt seen test driving a Falcon XR6 at his local Ford dealer was he?
Oz.

ROFL!!!

I think you should know, look at the arguments in older Toyota articles. e.g. “Toyota beats holden and ford combined”.
Oz.

[b]Bold[/b] Just testing
Oz.

Damn it doesn’t work
Foggy

Oz, use the to enclose your tags, that’s true html, not this forum [b] crap!
Foggy

Damn, it removed the “greater than” and “less than” symbols from my last post!
Oz.

“use the to enclose your tags”

?
No Name

Ha Ha you guys make me laugh. Is that the same stuff that comes up when you formatting in the forum? Test it there then.
Kenzo

if they do this, why dont they charge fat people more for going on airplanes. i mean they are going to have to burn more fuel to carry a 120kg person rather than a 60kg person. yet the air plane ticket price is the same.
WILDB

Actually TP there is plenty that the Falcon has over the Aurion. 1. Torque – 383nm at 2500rpm VS 336nm at 4700rpm! This means incase you are not sharp enough to realise that you have to rev the Aurion harder to get it properly moving than the Falcon and in doing so using more fuel. 2. By the way ADR fuel test figures are crap and you should not base arguments on them. The sticker on my Falcon says 11.4L/100km but I can tell you that I ALWAYS get better than that even in the city. And lastly on more than 1 occasion motoring jurno’s have called the Aurion (of all variants I might add) a one trick pony “Fast in a straight line but atrocious through corners.” Unless you have driven both I suggest you keep your one eyed opinions to yourself. And before you say it, I have driven both and definately know which one I prefer because after all if I liked the Aurion I would have bought one.
jbot

WILDB, you have clearly never driven in a real city. The only street in the the town with a traffic light doesn’t count. You do not get 11.4L/100km if you do much inner-city driving in any major city (Sydney, Melb, Brisbane – not Adelaide, traffic there is actually very good). Simple fact for you. Two Falcons in the family, 1 averages 14.2 (BFII), mostly city driving, the other (AUIII) averages about the same, with a bit more suburban driving on top of the city traffic.
jbot

I might add 14.2L/km is still good considering the driving conditions, but nothing like what WILDB gets in his imaginary world.
WILDB

Imaginary hey. Sure, you can think what you want and by the way I would call Brisbane a real city.
WILDB

It comes down to how you drive, if you drive like a dick then you get bad economy. Car is a manual not an auto and of all of the auto’s I have owned and in particular Falcon’s the autos chew the juice.
treno_186

I would say that WILDB is not living in an imaginary world as I own an 03 BA XR6 with the T5 manual with a K&N Filter and I can easily get under 11L/100 in suburban driving although admittedly I dont live in the city I live in outer suburbs. In saying this however I do plenty of stopping and starting in my driving due to traffic.
jbot

Drive in rush hour for a bit then tell me you can get 11.4 WILDB. I can get under in mine, but 14.2 is the overall average for the BFII. Highway runs are great, but no car that size can do well in rush hour.
treno_186

JBot is your falcon the old BTR 4sp Auto or the ZF 6 speeder becuase that is terrible economy. Before the XR I had a BAII Ghia with the BTR when I travelled into central Sydney everyday and I got about 12.5L/100 avg and that is not according to the gauge because they are always inaccurate. Perhaps your right boot gets plenty of work?

Work out the ACTUAL economy by dividing number of L by the number of KM so for 450k from 50L you go 50/4.5 = 11.1

Have a go and see what you come up with.
treno_186

My BA XR is actually worse on the HWY because of the short 5th in these T5 boxes. My Ghia used more city but less HWY than my XR.
WILDB

I am not going to have an argument over what fuel economy is achievable in my car because it is obvious you don’t believe it. I was stating that MY FALCON and other ones at work (all manual as well) use LESS fuel than all bar one of the company Aurions (4 base and 1 sportivo use more fuel) over the SAME ROADS. The only one which uses less is the boses (sorry, didn’t take notice of the model, top of the range I think)
jbot

That average is going off the trip computer. And unfortunately its the 4-speed. Its not my car, but I use it occasionally. It would proably do 60% of its driving in the rush hours, so 14.2 not that bad really.
treno_186

Jbot, I figured that would be a trip computer reading. My trip computer is showing 13.2L/100km but by calculating the L divide distance it shows my TRUE avg for this week anyway is 11.21L/100km. Work it out and I think you will be supprised.